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GREY-AID

Grey-Aid is an initiative set up by Greyhound-Data Limited with the support of GRV (Greyhound Racing Victoria) and other Australian based greyhound racing clubs, participants and adoption groups.

We are asking our members worldwide to support us in our effort to raise funds to be distributed throughout Australia in real time to greyhound owners that have been directly impacted by the recent Australian Bush Fire disaster.

It is time for the owners and their dogs to return home, or return to what is left of their homes.

Thank you everyone for helping all Australian Greyhounds in their time of need.

The devastation Australia is currently going through is uniting us as a nation and with your help and determination we can unite worldwide as greyhound owners.

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Sandown Chief Executive Greg Miller resigns


Kevin Wright
Australia
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Posts 5278
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22 Oct 2019 12:26


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What a shame Greg will not get to see his pet project fail ...
As they say if you cannot stand the heat get out of the Kitchen ....
Maybe the stupidity of forming a Syndicate and a breeding farm with Members funds contributed to his decision..

I here maybe the syndicate greed machine is getting shut down and there will be deregulation once again for all syndicates big and small common sense prevails hopefully .

EXTERNAL LINK


Boris Bertschik
Australia
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22 Oct 2019 14:29


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I think you are wrong, I don't where you get this rubbish from.Firstly you will find that Greg Miller will be joining GRV in new year, and as for Sandown syndicates being shut down, well George F now works full time @ Sandown exclusively looking after and arranging new syndicates.



Kevin Wright
Australia
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Posts 5278
Dogs 1 / Races 1

22 Oct 2019 20:57


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Boris Bertschik wrote:

I think you are wrong, I don't where you get this rubbish from.Firstly you will find that Greg Miller will be joining GRV in new year, and as for Sandown syndicates being shut down, well George F now works full time @ Sandown exclusively looking after and arranging new syndicates.


I bet your Spollys Mate ....lol
Boris im not WRONG ..I am right so maybe go ask a OTB if they agree with Puppy farm and if they support regulating Syndicates ..
Boris why do we regulate syndicates when the Horse racing industry DEREGULATED its Syndicates
Boris did you click the link ...
Boris ....I am talking about deregulating the syndicates not the Sandown Syndicates already up and running .

Who cares about George F he can say and do what he wants and didn't he pay overs for a heap of so called well bred pups for the syndicates ...

People getting paid consultancy fees for paying overs for mates pups ....

You work it out Boris and maybe go out to the tracks and speak to the OTB about these issues above .
Every person i have spoken too at Sandown and Cranbourne plus on the phone for many months all agree with me so Boris when u get your facts sorted fire away again but make sure your gun is loaded or else i will shoot you first ..lol




Boris Bertschik
Australia
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22 Oct 2019 23:04


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Who is "Spolly",I definitely don't know anyone by that name (or knickname).



Kevin Wright
Australia
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Posts 5278
Dogs 1 / Races 1

23 Oct 2019 00:00


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Boris Bertschik wrote:

Who is "Spolly",I definitely don't know anyone by that name (or knickname).


Boris ...in early 2018 two passionate greyhound racing businesses came together to form Greyhound Syndicating Services (GSS)...lol

Sandown Greyhounds Racing Club (Sandown) and Spolly Syndications Pty Ltd (SSPL) had a vision to offer greyhound syndicates of the highest integrity and standards. ...LOL

There was nothing wrong with the syndicates and to show how stupid this is the horse racing industry just DEREGULATED there industry

Boris word of advice if you want to comment make sure you have all of your little ducks lined up before you shoot from the hip .....



Ross Farmer
Australia
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Posts 201
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23 Oct 2019 00:48


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To set the record straight.

Racing syndicates are financial products, that must meet the requirements of Corporations law if offered to the public. These requirements do not apply to private syndicates.

Horse racing syndicates (thoroughbred & harness) get concessional treatment via an ASIC 'instrument'. Greyhound syndicates don't. (The offer from ASIC was there over 5 years ago & not acted upon).

This means that public greyhound syndicators should meet all licensing & compliance requirements, with no concessions. The cost of all this is unjustifiable without volume.

Until Sandown initiated its syndicates, greyhound syndicates offered to the public did not comply with the Corporations Act. So what Sandown offered was something new, and directed at bringing in new people. It was not directed at eroding the existing syndicate base. Those that did go into the syndicates were provided with full knowledge of what they were getting into, including the risks, and pay a higher price.

Sandown also injected funds into the industry at a time when it was needed.

ASIC views greyhound syndicates as 'marginal' financial products, where most are private syndicates that are outside corporations law. For the other syndicates, ASIC takes the stance that there is limited publication and limited participants involved. As it doesn't have the resources to deal with every breach of corporate law, the practicality is that it won't devote resources to low level complaints, and expects breaches to be best left to civil action.

Sow hat all this means is that private syndicates proceed as normal. And those syndicates that commit technical breaches of Corporations law should also be able to proceed as normal, and not be affected by the Sandown direction or the risk of ASIC involvement.

Their bigger risk is that they do the wrong thing, and get a bad name in the industry. Overwhelmingly, the long-term syndicators do it well.

There are better ways to handle how public greyhound syndicates can operate without minor/technical breaches of Corporations law, but that is another subject.



Kevin Wright
Australia
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Posts 5278
Dogs 1 / Races 1

23 Oct 2019 01:21


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Ross Farmer wrote:

To set the record straight.

Racing syndicates are financial products, that must meet the requirements of Corporations law if offered to the public. These requirements do not apply to private syndicates.

Horse racing syndicates (thoroughbred & harness) get concessional treatment via an ASIC 'instrument'. Greyhound syndicates don't. (The offer from ASIC was there over 5 years ago & not acted upon).

This means that public greyhound syndicators should meet all licensing & compliance requirements, with no concessions. The cost of all this is unjustifiable without volume.

Until Sandown initiated its syndicates, greyhound syndicates offered to the public did not comply with the Corporations Act. So what Sandown offered was something new, and directed at bringing in new people. It was not directed at eroding the existing syndicate base. Those that did go into the syndicates were provided with full knowledge of what they were getting into, including the risks, and pay a higher price.

Sandown also injected funds into the industry at a time when it was needed.

ASIC views greyhound syndicates as 'marginal' financial products, where most are private syndicates that are outside corporations law. For the other syndicates, ASIC takes the stance that there is limited publication and limited participants involved. As it doesn't have the resources to deal with every breach of corporate law, the practicality is that it won't devote resources to low level complaints, and expects breaches to be best left to civil action.

Sow hat all this means is that private syndicates proceed as normal. And those syndicates that commit technical breaches of Corporations law should also be able to proceed as normal, and not be affected by the Sandown direction or the risk of ASIC involvement.

Their bigger risk is that they do the wrong thing, and get a bad name in the industry. Overwhelmingly, the long-term syndicators do it well.

There are better ways to handle how public greyhound syndicates can operate without minor/technical breaches of Corporations law, but that is another subject.


So what Sandown offered was something new, and directed at bringing in new people. It was not directed at eroding the existing syndicate base. Those that did go into the syndicates were provided with full knowledge of what they were getting into, including the risks, and pay a higher price.

Sandown also injected funds into the industry at a time when it was needed.

No Ross let me set your record straight
At no time did the GRV Sandown or Spollys engage with existing stake holders.
At no time did the GRV Sandown or Spollys engage with existing syndicates
Sandown engaged with Spollys so it could get its syndicate deals over the line and large amount of money was paid to Spollys from Sandown ..This is a FACT

When does a Club become a business that goes directly into competition with its own members spending millions of members money for a puppy breeding farm .

Even our own GOTBA support spollys and sandowns syndications ....Why is this so have some got vested interests ......No wonder membership is at a all time low and even you Ross had a stint on the GOBTA committee .

Ross why dont you speak to all of the present syndicate manager and ask them have these new syndicate rules affect their business because guess what Ross they have all been shafted by the GRV GOTBA and Sandown and spollys syndications .

Why didnt Sandown and the GRV inject funds back into our own breeding industry and reward breeders once again like the GOBIS once did .

To say Sandown and Spollys saved breeding in Victoria is bullshit Ross ..

If i am speaking shit ross then why are the syndicate managers and the GRV now in talks to deregulate syndications ....

As i said Ross ring around speak to the syndicate guys one on one .....

I will also add so many people our members in victoria feel they cannot speak out because of the reprisals that always follow....

I would love for a few syndicate managers to comment in this forum but i also understand they cannot and it's a shame when people feel this way because we all have the right to our say right or wrong wouldn't you agree Ross



Sam Watson
Australia
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23 Oct 2019 02:51


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While i agree with Kevin regarding syndicates, Sandown could have at least partnered with a syndicate company that actually has a record of producing quality dogs... so that owners had a chance of recouping some of their costs to enter. More chance of a return by burning their money than with some of their pups they've syndicated.

Spolly's even said they don't keep a record of their pups that have race starts and to how many wins/placing etc they have with their dogs. Not very professional for an 'ASIC licensed company' to not even track the most important KPI of their business.

As Kevin said, this is why Horse racing will continue to thrive, while certain parts of the dogs will continue to be stagnate. Lets hope the talks to deregulate happen as i know of plenty of good syndicates out there that do a great job of not only attracting new buyers, but KEEPING them as they get good results.





Kevin Wright
Australia
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23 Oct 2019 04:06


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Sam Watson wrote:

While i agree with Kevin regarding syndicates, Sandown could have at least partnered with a syndicate company that actually has a record of producing quality dogs... so that owners had a chance of recouping some of their costs to enter. More chance of a return by burning their money than with some of their pups they've syndicated.

Spolly's even said they don't keep a record of their pups that have race starts and to how many wins/placing etc they have with their dogs. Not very professional for an 'ASIC licensed company' to not even track the most important KPI of their business.

As Kevin said, this is why Horse racing will continue to thrive, while certain parts of the dogs will continue to be stagnate. Lets hope the talks to deregulate happen as i know of plenty of good syndicates out there that do a great job of not only attracting new buyers, but KEEPING them as they get good results.


Sam as you know we have a heap of fantastic syndicates out there who have been up and running for many years with great success and they all should of been consulted before the Unknown Spolly syndications
All syndicates offer something very special in Australia its about friendships and lasting bonds between themselves and the Trainer and the hope that your dog will win a Melbourne Cup or take out a Group race.

I want to know what happens to all of the slow sandown and spolys Syndicate Dogs do they get special treatment for GAP placement or do they have to support their own GAP centre ...Who pays for the losses when no one is accountable ....




Simon Moore
Australia
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Posts 2270
Dogs 32 / Races 393

23 Oct 2019 09:17


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Sam Watson wrote:

While i agree with Kevin regarding syndicates, Sandown could have at least partnered with a syndicate company that actually has a record of producing quality dogs... so that owners had a chance of recouping some of their costs to enter. More chance of a return by burning their money than with some of their pups they've syndicated.

Spolly's even said they don't keep a record of their pups that have race starts and to how many wins/placing etc they have with their dogs. Not very professional for an 'ASIC licensed company' to not even track the most important KPI of their business.

As Kevin said, this is why Horse racing will continue to thrive, while certain parts of the dogs will continue to be stagnate. Lets hope the talks to deregulate happen as i know of plenty of good syndicates out there that do a great job of not only attracting new buyers, but KEEPING them as they get good results.


if they had a fantastic record i'm sure they would be boasting about all their winners.
thats my opinion anyway.


Darren Bridges
Australia
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Dogs 65 / Races 115

24 Oct 2019 07:21


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A two minute search finds this

Greyhounds transition from a racing career to the life of a beautiful pet. I am sure you are aware of the relaxed and loyal nature of the breed.

Nominate the lot number, fill in the below application and you can be the owner of the greyhound you have chosen when he or she finishes their career.

Make your no obligation (we understand circumstances can change) application and once successful we will:
•Engage your thoughts in determining the name of the racing greyhound. Syndicate owners will submit their preference. We will then seek your help in submitting the top 12 in preference order to Greyhounds Australasia for naming
•Be our non-financial “21st Owner” (20 by 5% syndicate owners) and receive all correspondence during your greyhounds pre and racing career
•Invites to syndicate function and race days
•Take home your greyhound once their racing days are over*

*This may be delayed a short time for a desensitization phase or a longer time if the greyhound is of an elite standard and considered for stud duties.

This ownership post career opportunity is also available to financial syndicate members.




Kevin Wright
Australia
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Posts 5278
Dogs 1 / Races 1

24 Oct 2019 07:36


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darren bridges wrote:

A two minute search finds this

Greyhounds transition from a racing career to the life of a beautiful pet. I am sure you are aware of the relaxed and loyal nature of the breed.

Nominate the lot number, fill in the below application and you can be the owner of the greyhound you have chosen when he or she finishes their career.

Make your no obligation (we understand circumstances can change) application and once successful we will:
•Engage your thoughts in determining the name of the racing greyhound. Syndicate owners will submit their preference. We will then seek your help in submitting the top 12 in preference order to Greyhounds Australasia for naming
•Be our non-financial “21st Owner” (20 by 5% syndicate owners) and receive all correspondence during your greyhounds pre and racing career
•Invites to syndicate function and race days
•Take home your greyhound once their racing days are over*

*This may be delayed a short time for a desensitization phase or a longer time if the greyhound is of an elite standard and considered for stud duties.

This ownership post career opportunity is also available to financial syndicate members.


5 sec search found this ...
In early 2018 two passionate greyhound racing businesses came together to form Greyhound Syndicating Services (GSS).

Sandown Greyhounds Racing Club (Sandown) and Spolly Syndications Pty Ltd (SSPL) had a vision to offer greyhound syndicates of the highest integrity and standards. The general public can be assured that the syndicates will maintain high animal welfare standards, comply with applicable national greyhound licensing laws and the Corporations Act.

GSS considers, in accordance with policy of Greyhound Racing Victoria, that syndication has a critically important role in the future of our industry, supporting increased participation, introducing new owners to the sport.

As an authorised representative of Primary Securities, GSS provides syndication services to support racing clubs, syndicators, trainers, breeders and/or owners in promoting and managing greyhound syndicates in accordance with applicable laws, and with a view to maintaining high animal welfare standards and enhancing the greyhound industry.

GSS has entered into an agreement with Primary Securities Ltd (PSL) to act as responsible entity for a registered scheme to be operated by GSS. PSL holds Australian financial services license 224107 under which it is authorised to act as responsible entity for any financial asset registered managed investment scheme.

Greyhound syndicates are subject to the managed investment scheme rules of the Corporations Act 2001. As the Australian Securities and Investments Commission (ASIC) has not provided class order relief from these provisions for the promoters or managers of greyhound syndicates, GSS and PSL have devised a compliance solution for greyhound syndicate promoters and managers by investors being in a multi-class financial assets trust, with each class investing (via Primary Securities) in a separate greyhound syndicate.





Kevin Wright
Australia
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Dogs 1 / Races 1

24 Oct 2019 07:43


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In early 2018 two passionate greyhound racing businesses came together to form Greyhound Syndicating Services (GSS).




Ross Farmer
Australia
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Dogs 0 / Races 1

25 Oct 2019 17:44


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Kevin

Clarifying points made
1. At no time did the GRV Sandown or Spollys engage with existing stake holders.
- I never stated it did.

2. At no time did the GRV Sandown or Spollys engage with existing syndicates
- I never said it did.

3. Sandown engaged with Spollys so it could get its syndicate deals over the line and large amount of money was paid to Spollys from Sandown
- Sandown probably engaged with Spolly's because they sponsored clubs. However, it is incorrect to state Sandown paid Spolly's anything - it hasn't.

4. even you Ross had a stint on the GOBTA committee .
- Yes, this does reflect my willingness to support participants via GOTBA, and did fill in the vacant Treasurer's role at the time. Though not sure of any relevance to the topic.

5. To say Sandown and Spollys saved breeding in Victoria is bullshit Ross
- I didn't say it did, nor do I think it did.

6. why are the syndicate managers and the GRV now in talks to deregulate syndications
- Progress is via GRV submissions to ASIC. I was at the syndication workshop run by GRV, where 4 syndicators were present. Syndicators and I have contact with GRV on syndications progress, and I have kept in contact with several syndicators since.
Those who went to the workshop know that they can operate as before, as GRV did provide that assurance. GRV also stated its enforcement scope was ensuring syndicates operate to the Rules. I have advised those that didn't attend of the GRV stance that was presented at the workshop.

There is a clear distinction between Sandown syndications (via the Draft Teams) and the Spolly's syndications. The common denominator is that syndicates for both operate under the same Authorised Representative for Prime Securities.

A far bigger issue for the industry is the apparent inability of regulators to effectively manage an industry, and flow on effects such as lack of dogs and participant returns that have not kept pace with cost increases.

As a Sandown member, I am comfortable that Sandown has invested in the industry. Someone had to, as GRV have not similarly encouraged or supported private investment, or training facilities.

That said, I do support syndicators who have compliance questions, and am considering a option to overcome any possible crackdown on their operations.

I view the Sandown approach and existing syndicators approach as different, and believe both can co-exist.

Whether it is a financial success is another matter, as is whether there is any conflict of interest in clubs running such syndicates where the dogs then race at their track. But ultimately such decisions are for the club Board & GRV.

Getting back to the topic, Greg Miller has shown commercial vision and aptitude in developing the syndications direction, and if those skills operated at industry level, the industry wouldn't have the problems it now has.



Kevin Wright
Australia
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Posts 5278
Dogs 1 / Races 1

25 Oct 2019 20:56


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Ross Farmer wrote:

Kevin

Clarifying points made
1. At no time did the GRV Sandown or Spollys engage with existing stake holders.
- I never stated it did.

2. At no time did the GRV Sandown or Spollys engage with existing syndicates
- I never said it did.

3. Sandown engaged with Spollys so it could get its syndicate deals over the line and large amount of money was paid to Spollys from Sandown
- Sandown probably engaged with Spolly's because they sponsored clubs. However, it is incorrect to state Sandown paid Spolly's anything - it hasn't.

4. even you Ross had a stint on the GOBTA committee .
- Yes, this does reflect my willingness to support participants via GOTBA, and did fill in the vacant Treasurer's role at the time. Though not sure of any relevance to the topic.

5. To say Sandown and Spollys saved breeding in Victoria is bullshit Ross
- I didn't say it did, nor do I think it did.

6. why are the syndicate managers and the GRV now in talks to deregulate syndications
- Progress is via GRV submissions to ASIC. I was at the syndication workshop run by GRV, where 4 syndicators were present. Syndicators and I have contact with GRV on syndications progress, and I have kept in contact with several syndicators since.
Those who went to the workshop know that they can operate as before, as GRV did provide that assurance. GRV also stated its enforcement scope was ensuring syndicates operate to the Rules. I have advised those that didn't attend of the GRV stance that was presented at the workshop.

There is a clear distinction between Sandown syndications (via the Draft Teams) and the Spolly's syndications. The common denominator is that syndicates for both operate under the same Authorised Representative for Prime Securities.

A far bigger issue for the industry is the apparent inability of regulators to effectively manage an industry, and flow on effects such as lack of dogs and participant returns that have not kept pace with cost increases.

As a Sandown member, I am comfortable that Sandown has invested in the industry. Someone had to, as GRV have not similarly encouraged or supported private investment, or training facilities.

That said, I do support syndicators who have compliance questions, and am considering a option to overcome any possible crackdown on their operations.

I view the Sandown approach and existing syndicators approach as different, and believe both can co-exist.

Whether it is a financial success is another matter, as is whether there is any conflict of interest in clubs running such syndicates where the dogs then race at their track. But ultimately such decisions are for the club Board & GRV.

Getting back to the topic, Greg Miller has shown commercial vision and aptitude in developing the syndications direction, and if those skills operated at industry level, the industry wouldn't have the problems it now has.


Ross
You support spending well over 3 mill on Millers Puppy Farm ..Why didn't they spend that money supporting existing Syndicates and Breeders .

Ross you are WRONG Spollys was payed money from Sandown plus Spollys gets a free run at all Tracks advertising Spolly SPAM ...

You seem to think Syndicates can operate as usual and you are in talks with Syndicate Managers ...
Well ROSS we must be talking to two different groups then .

I think your full of Shit Ross and your defending of Miller and Spolly shows me you are not in any talks with Syndicate Managers ...

How many AGREE'S have your posts got so far Ross

Page 53 GRV 2018/2019 Annual Report.
"(2) Sandown Greyhound racing Club (“SGRC”)
In 2019 the GRV Board reviewed and approved a
loan application from the Sandown GRC for the purchase
of a property in Toongabbie, Victoria for the purposes
of developing a greyhound rearing, education and rehoming
facility. The initial $0.65m loan was advanced in
accordance with GRV’s innovation grants & loans
application requirements with the balance to be finalised
in 2020 at which time the loan will be discounted having
regard to the likely repayment terms."

Copied from Gringo on AGF.
I doubt the Sandown rearing farm will ever come to fruition, if ever they solve the problems with the proposal it would be at least 3 years after that in the setting up of the property.

It is just another white elephant that GRV are using to deflect scrutiny away from the real day to day issues of greyhound racing, especially the problems caused by the shortage of racing stock.

I have visited the property and walked all over it, it is surrounded by small 5/20 acre holdings all of whom would be objecting to the noise and odour of hundreds of pups next door.
It is also flood prone land which means drainage alone would cost close to a million dollars.
It is also devoid of any trees, I would estimate a minimum 10/15 thousand trees would be needed to be planted, a conservative cost would be half a million dollars.

IF they can overcome those problems then they would have to build the complex to COP standards, conservative cost around a million dollars.
Then they have to consider staffing the venue, minimum a manager, six workers and a full time veterinarian, wages of close to a million dollars annually.
Then there is the equipment needed to maintain the property, cost of about half a million dollars.

How could they justify spending a minimum of 3 million dollars with the uncertainty surrounding the sport today??




Boris Bertschik
Australia
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23 Dec 2019 03:19


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Greg Miller appointed to board GRV, mmm don't say I didn't tell you all.



Kevin Wright
Australia
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Posts 5278
Dogs 1 / Races 1

23 Dec 2019 08:13


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Boris Bertschik wrote:

Greg Miller appointed to board GRV, mmm don't say I didn't tell you all.


Nothing surprises me anymore ...
I cannot wait until they start putting on races only for Syndicate dogs ..Only
I guess Greg will be stepping down from his little baby the Sandown Puppy farm and Syndicates because you would think there is going to be a huge conflict of interest ...



Hayden Gilders
Australia
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Posts 768
Dogs 26 / Races 0

24 Dec 2019 00:55


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So is the current position - Greg Miller signed off as a borrower (his club) of 650k and now is in a position to negotiate that same loan for the lender....?


Sam Watson
Australia
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Posts 222
Dogs 0 / Races 0

24 Dec 2019 02:23


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Kevin Wright wrote:

Boris Bertschik wrote:

Greg Miller appointed to board GRV, mmm don't say I didn't tell you all.


Nothing surprises me anymore ...
I cannot wait until they start putting on races only for Syndicate dogs ..Only
I guess Greg will be stepping down from his little baby the Sandown Puppy farm and Syndicates because you would think there is going to be a huge conflict of interest ...

If they do put on races just for their dogs, it will be a weaker class than T3 in Vic haha



Kevin Wright
Australia
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Posts 5278
Dogs 1 / Races 1

24 Dec 2019 04:21


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Hayden Gilders wrote:

So is the current position - Greg Miller signed off as a borrower (his club) of 650k and now is in a position to negotiate that same loan for the lender....?


Exactly ..HG ..

Sam they will get a few quick ones and as you can see they are paying overs for all pups they have purchased so far ...

The Sandown Puppy Mill will be something i will follow with great interest ...

I see Spollys had there wings clipped so at least i cannot see any more free money or advertisement going there way in fact they wont be around in a few years time once everyone wakes up to there present activitys ..

Sandown and Greg Miller will go down as the greatest con job ever in the history of Greyhound racing ....

Let Sandown waste its members money and if they think they can breed instant success then someone please tell Greg he is dreaming

..I will also be interested to see how many of Sandown Puppy Mill pups will make it to Gap compared to winners on the Track ...%

PS
I will never support Sandown or Greg Miller and i think everyone has been brainwashed to think this is the best thing for the INDUSTRY ....

The best thing for the industry is to bring back GOBIS or some form of GOBIS ....We need to support and keep supporting the grass roots OTB...

I also want to wish the GRV integrity unit a very Merry xmas as well ..
and i hope you guys get your act together in 2020 because 2019 was a complete waste of money ever in the history of the GRV .....Millions spent fighting crime but in fact it was millions spent on nothing as nothing was achieved and nothing ever will be achieved when you have Monkeys running the show IMO ....I hope you all got a nice big bag of Peanuts for your XMas bonus ....

posts 20