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A different future is facing uspage  1 2 3 4 5 6 

Bruce Teague
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 2092
Dogs 0 / Races 0

01 Apr 2020 02:37


 (4)
 (0)


I dont know if anyone has been doing the arithmetic but the medium and long term is going to pose severe difficulties for many participants, particularly trainers and their staff. The forgotten factor is that there are two fresh deterrents which will reduce breeding. The geographical restrictions on the movement of dogs and people are virtually unavoidable and the mindset of future owner-breeders is doubtful anyway.

Both must seriously affect the numbers from 2021 onwards, if not earlier. Arguably, the change will be of LB proportions or worse. Sorry to be dismal but this is a near-factual outlook. (Please take no notice of fanciful waffle from some authorities about a breeding recovery. After five years, todays activity is nowhere near pre-2015 levels barely more than half).

Consequently, trainers will have fewer dogs to train, punters will have fewer races to bet on and staff cuts at racing authorities and some clubs will be needed urgently. This will happen regardless of any subsidies or someone waving a magic wand and terminating the coronavirus threat (a logical guess would be to assume it hangs around in some form for a couple of years).

Currently, the NSW track closures seemed to be an over-reaction compared to the Victorian little-change posture but in time it may well prove to be a much sounder move. Empty boxes are already a problem not helped by the canine virus - but they are likely to become more common as time goes on.

Now is the time to devise programs (at least a Plan B) to better match likely future supply and demand. Or to allow trainers and others to plant new crops, set up new businesses, or retire. The industry needs major reform at all levels.

GAP may experience a mini-boom but then it will die off again. Greyhound handling expertise may be transferable to other breeds and different purposes buying into puppy farms, for example, or training other working dogs. Six-dog fields will need re-evaluation. In NSW, restoring straight track racing and coursing should be a major priority, albeit not for big money. The opportunity to move away from Wenty is clear.

Authorities should be organising professional career-change advice for participants. The public and local councils need to be brought on board. You could even eliminate any racing below 400m. Its a long list, but a pressing one, so dont wait till the horse has bolted.




Martyn Empson
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 149
Dogs 0 / Races 3

01 Apr 2020 03:36


 (3)
 (0)


EXTERNAL LINK


Michael Geraghty
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4138
Dogs 14 / Races 15

01 Apr 2020 04:02


 (3)
 (0)


I'm not sure where your "us" comes into it...it's an inclusion you are no inclusion of!

Having said that, this is one of the rare moments I agree with you.

You forgot one major deterrent for breeding...job losses.

I just had this conversation this morning and followed that with a phone call to RQ...waiting on a reply.

If authorities don't put a plan in action NOW, there will be enormous ramifications in the near future.

Incentives to breed NOW must be at the forefront of their planning, otherwise it will be a disaster!
Those plans must include owner/breeder incentives because the pool of buyers will reduce because of forced budgeting priorities.

The industry could well be torn apart, Torn.



Simon Moore
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 2366
Dogs 32 / Races 393

01 Apr 2020 05:34


 (4)
 (0)


u should know better Michael, lol.


David Plumridge
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 414
Dogs 563 / Races 127

01 Apr 2020 05:40


 (1)
 (0)


I see the glass half full not half empty. GRVictoria certainly are helping I believe with participants to breed - some fees are gone or very minimal. Plenty of races in vic for all kind of dogs abilities.
The current Government whilst in the past could have & tried closing down greyhounds knows now how much it is worth not only to the economy but to everyone involved ......businesses, owners, breeders and the well being of people especially country folk. The GAP program in Vic has been ia huge success and I don't think the stats say it has levelled out yet and once greys that have been adopted over the last 5 yrs pass away due to old age, hopefully they'll get another one.



Jack Ogilvie
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 15478
Dogs 0 / Races 1

01 Apr 2020 08:25


 (5)
 (0)


A wise man once said the future belongs to those who plan for it
Jack Ogilvie 2020. Lol
For those of us who have been in the industry for a long time, and have seen the ups and downs.we have also seen those who have taken advantage of a situation, and are now leaders in the many facets of the industry.yes we are all F**ked .If you believe that get out now tail between your legs. All this negative crap will kill us .
Steven white is a perfect example of a person who tipped all the shit out of his head .sold up in NSW ,shifted to Victoria like a couple of others and they have never looked back. Your opportunity is there. If people want to tip their shit into my head I just think no ,as I love my ears,I just shake my head ,and tip all their shit out of my head.Think about it be a survivor.
Cheers and best wishes jack.


Michael Geraghty
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4138
Dogs 14 / Races 15

01 Apr 2020 11:03


 (1)
 (0)


simon moore wrote:

u should know better Michael, lol.

Yep, I'd have to agree with that, Simon.
The thing is, I was actually going to post a similar topic today but buggalugs beat me to it.
Mr. Uswe does have some valid points however he's such a lucky bugger none of it affects him...

Forward planning and action is needed now because this once in a lifetime disaster is going to hit future spending big time.

David, you're right. Victoria is leading the way in that area but most other states now lag behind and need to act now.

Aaah, Mr. Uswe Torn...catchy name.



Tony Digiorgio
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 1008
Dogs 25 / Races 0

01 Apr 2020 21:23


 (4)
 (0)


I can't see anything wrong with what Bruce has posted.
What he has said is what we are all faced with.



Tony Gallagher
Australia
(Team Member)
Posts 5908
Dogs 12949 / Races 40209

01 Apr 2020 22:40


 (6)
 (0)


In life the only thing that wont change is that there always will be change.

In all walks of life the ability to acknowledge things are changing and adapt is the only way to survive.

The greyhound industry will adapt and we will come out the other side.

We as participants all have different problems to face i.e. if you are a professional trainer you need people to put dogs with you, If you breed you need to sell pups, if you are an owner you need funds from your job or business to stay in the game etc. Then of course we have the problem of our age and whether or not we want to continue with all that is going on.

So a single solution without all participants input simply will not work.

We need to assess our position within the sport and become as efficient and professional as possible.

Unity and working with the official greyhound bodies has never been more important.





Jack Ogilvie
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 15478
Dogs 0 / Races 1

02 Apr 2020 01:42


 (1)
 (0)


So true mate. Want to buy a pup, now is an opportunity,buyers market.


Mark Staines
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4497
Dogs 70 / Races 14

02 Apr 2020 03:03


 (4)
 (0)


Bruce Teague wrote:

I dont know if anyone has been doing the arithmetic but the medium and long term is going to pose severe difficulties for many participants, particularly trainers and their staff. The forgotten factor is that there are two fresh deterrents which will reduce breeding. The geographical restrictions on the movement of dogs and people are virtually unavoidable and the mindset of future owner-breeders is doubtful anyway.

Both must seriously affect the numbers from 2021 onwards, if not earlier. Arguably, the change will be of LB proportions or worse. Sorry to be dismal but this is a near-factual outlook. (Please take no notice of fanciful waffle from some authorities about a breeding recovery. After five years, todays activity is nowhere near pre-2015 levels barely more than half).

Consequently, trainers will have fewer dogs to train, punters will have fewer races to bet on and staff cuts at racing authorities and some clubs will be needed urgently. This will happen regardless of any subsidies or someone waving a magic wand and terminating the coronavirus threat (a logical guess would be to assume it hangs around in some form for a couple of years).

Currently, the NSW track closures seemed to be an over-reaction compared to the Victorian little-change posture but in time it may well prove to be a much sounder move. Empty boxes are already a problem not helped by the canine virus - but they are likely to become more common as time goes on.

Now is the time to devise programs (at least a Plan B) to better match likely future supply and demand. Or to allow trainers and others to plant new crops, set up new businesses, or retire. The industry needs major reform at all levels.

GAP may experience a mini-boom but then it will die off again. Greyhound handling expertise may be transferable to other breeds and different purposes buying into puppy farms, for example, or training other working dogs. Six-dog fields will need re-evaluation. In NSW, restoring straight track racing and coursing should be a major priority, albeit not for big money. The opportunity to move away from Wenty is clear.

Authorities should be organising professional career-change advice for participants. The public and local councils need to be brought on board. You could even eliminate any racing below 400m. Its a long list, but a pressing one, so dont wait till the horse has bolted.

Written by none other than the "Prophet Of Doom"


Tony Digiorgio
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 1008
Dogs 25 / Races 0

02 Apr 2020 03:39


 (1)
 (0)


So how do you see the current situation Mark?


Mark Staines
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4497
Dogs 70 / Races 14

02 Apr 2020 04:49


 (4)
 (0)


Another Hurdle we will clear, not the end of the World like the "Prophet Of Doom" is predicting !!!!!



Kevin Wright
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 5708
Dogs 1 / Races 1

02 Apr 2020 05:17


 (6)
 (0)


Bruce Teague wrote:

I dont know if anyone has been doing the arithmetic but the medium and long term is going to pose severe difficulties for many participants, particularly trainers and their staff. The forgotten factor is that there are two fresh deterrents which will reduce breeding. The geographical restrictions on the movement of dogs and people are virtually unavoidable and the mindset of future owner-breeders is doubtful anyway.

Both must seriously affect the numbers from 2021 onwards, if not earlier. Arguably, the change will be of LB proportions or worse. Sorry to be dismal but this is a near-factual outlook. (Please take no notice of fanciful waffle from some authorities about a breeding recovery. After five years, todays activity is nowhere near pre-2015 levels barely more than half).

Consequently, trainers will have fewer dogs to train, punters will have fewer races to bet on and staff cuts at racing authorities and some clubs will be needed urgently. This will happen regardless of any subsidies or someone waving a magic wand and terminating the coronavirus threat (a logical guess would be to assume it hangs around in some form for a couple of years).

Currently, the NSW track closures seemed to be an over-reaction compared to the Victorian little-change posture but in time it may well prove to be a much sounder move. Empty boxes are already a problem not helped by the canine virus - but they are likely to become more common as time goes on.

Now is the time to devise programs (at least a Plan B) to better match likely future supply and demand. Or to allow trainers and others to plant new crops, set up new businesses, or retire. The industry needs major reform at all levels.

GAP may experience a mini-boom but then it will die off again. Greyhound handling expertise may be transferable to other breeds and different purposes buying into puppy farms, for example, or training other working dogs. Six-dog fields will need re-evaluation. In NSW, restoring straight track racing and coursing should be a major priority, albeit not for big money. The opportunity to move away from Wenty is clear.

Authorities should be organising professional career-change advice for participants. The public and local councils need to be brought on board. You could even eliminate any racing below 400m. Its a long list, but a pressing one, so dont wait till the horse has bolted.


Tornado
Greyhound racing will bounce back in Australia .
The reason why is because of the little hobby OTB and the Amateurs...
Greyhound racing will fight back if it is giving right now Breeding incentives

The PRO'S may crumble at the edges but they have made a lot of money so they should survive if they don't then they don't deserve to and like in all Business and life there are risks and nothing is guaranteed with Greyhound racing ....Trainers come and go and everyone is replaceable...

Business are all crumbling at present and i don't want to see a bail out for the PRO'S From the PTB
..The Back yarders the hobby and Amateurs deserve all funding IMO



Malcolm Smart
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 12802
Dogs 19 / Races 34

02 Apr 2020 07:42


 (1)
 (0)


I'm not sure where your "us" comes into it...it's an inclusion you are no inclusion of!.......hahahahahahaha winner..!!


Michael Geraghty
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4138
Dogs 14 / Races 15

02 Apr 2020 09:23


 (0)
 (0)


About the only winner I've had in a month, Mal.
Mr. Uswe (pronounced "Ooswee" with a Finnish accent) might like to breed a litter to help the cause, seeing he has now included himself in "us".



Bruce Teague
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 2092
Dogs 0 / Races 0

03 Apr 2020 02:19


 (2)
 (0)


It is heartening to see many folk expressing hopeful thoughts about the future less so those who are pretending the shortcomings will all go away.

On review, and at the risk of repeating myself, there are two matters which will dominate our future.

First, this is a multi-faceted industry as most industries are. It takes all sorts to produce a winner over time, from the bloke selling pies at the track to the reporter telling the public what is happening to the lady taking down your bet at Tabcorp to the family having a bit of fun with a couple of dogs, to the educator taking on your pups (if any), and so on. All are required. Lose a link and you immediately have problems. The industry becomes less efficient, less effective and less attractive.

Second, we are facing a new and nasty hurdle. Yet coronavirus is just more of the same, although probably worse. Breeding is the core of the industry, one which got a huge thumping in LB times. And make no mistake - it has never recovered from that. After five years the industry has failed badly to get back to where it was pre-LB. Not even close. Potential owner-breeders were not impressed while authorities still have their fingers crossed. Why is this so?

Coronavirus will have the same sort of influence and it is being super-imposed on a weak base. Governments are on tenterhooks. The public is scared and short of cash. And Tasmania has just shut down all three codes. Racing in general is reliant on the might, the tax benefits and the cultural attachment accruing from the gallops. Greyhounds are along for the ride no more than that.

There will be no bounce back. So-called breeding incentives have had almost no impact to date (and never did pre-LB). Research is shallow at best. GAP is helpful as far as it goes but it, too, has offered no massive boost. Indeed, the opposite is sometimes true as private re-homers are inclined to dump on the industry (see the recent SMH article).

I outlined previously a number of measures the industry should take to counter all these issues but by far the major one is to totally reform the industry who runs it, how it is run, what the product is, how it is promoted, how to control betting, and so on. Throw out everything and start again. Its like a rough diamond which has to be carefully checked for faults and colours and then cut by a skilled operator before you dare stick it on an engagement ring and try to sell it.

In passing, one idea I do like is to sponsor a greater role on the part of the small, hobby owner/trainer. The more the merrier. The economics are not crash hot, but the political value is high.



Mark Staines
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4497
Dogs 70 / Races 14

03 Apr 2020 03:11


 (4)
 (0)


I had a Bitch mated 2 Days ago Bruce what are you doing to boost numbers ????



Kevin Wright
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 5708
Dogs 1 / Races 1

03 Apr 2020 03:44


 (6)
 (0)


Bruce Teague wrote:

It is heartening to see many folk expressing hopeful thoughts about the future less so those who are pretending the shortcomings will all go away.

On review, and at the risk of repeating myself, there are two matters which will dominate our future.

First, this is a multi-faceted industry as most industries are. It takes all sorts to produce a winner over time, from the bloke selling pies at the track to the reporter telling the public what is happening to the lady taking down your bet at Tabcorp to the family having a bit of fun with a couple of dogs, to the educator taking on your pups (if any), and so on. All are required. Lose a link and you immediately have problems. The industry becomes less efficient, less effective and less attractive.

Second, we are facing a new and nasty hurdle. Yet coronavirus is just more of the same, although probably worse. Breeding is the core of the industry, one which got a huge thumping in LB times. And make no mistake - it has never recovered from that. After five years the industry has failed badly to get back to where it was pre-LB. Not even close. Potential owner-breeders were not impressed while authorities still have their fingers crossed. Why is this so?

Coronavirus will have the same sort of influence and it is being super-imposed on a weak base. Governments are on tenterhooks. The public is scared and short of cash. And Tasmania has just shut down all three codes. Racing in general is reliant on the might, the tax benefits and the cultural attachment accruing from the gallops. Greyhounds are along for the ride no more than that.

There will be no bounce back. So-called breeding incentives have had almost no impact to date (and never did pre-LB). Research is shallow at best. GAP is helpful as far as it goes but it, too, has offered no massive boost. Indeed, the opposite is sometimes true as private re-homers are inclined to dump on the industry (see the recent SMH article).

I outlined previously a number of measures the industry should take to counter all these issues but by far the major one is to totally reform the industry who runs it, how it is run, what the product is, how it is promoted, how to control betting, and so on. Throw out everything and start again. Its like a rough diamond which has to be carefully checked for faults and colours and then cut by a skilled operator before you dare stick it on an engagement ring and try to sell it.

In passing, one idea I do like is to sponsor a greater role on the part of the small, hobby owner/trainer. The more the merrier. The economics are not crash hot, but the political value is high.


Tornado
Quote
I do like is to sponsor a greater role on the part of the small, hobby owner/trainer. The more the merrier. The economics are not crash hot, but the political value is high.

.Australia is Unique..
We run Amateurs and Pro's in the same racing pool ..

Smaller OTB will be our Savior ..
The Small back Yard Breeder and small time OTB will bounce back and it is from these Members our sport will continue .

The pro's are the ones under the microscope now ..

The Greyhound racing industrys back bone has always been the Small time OTB ...Some have lost sight of this over the past 10 Years ....





Grant Dunphy
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 743
Dogs 4 / Races 1

03 Apr 2020 06:00


 (8)
 (0)


Predicting Doom & Gloom again Bruce.

You have no idea how greyhound trainers feel about our Industry
& certainly no idea about what our needs & our dogs needs are.You
have no way of knowing because you are not an involved trainer.I can't even
adequately explain it to you.It comes with knowledge & experience.

I do know however that I really do resent your spruking what needs to happen.

Take WP-I happen to think Wenty has been improved in the last 30 years into a very serviceable city track- I do know that if we lose it to a greedy Government we will never get a suitable replacement in as central a position in NSW.As we have no private control in the Industry at present they will just close it without recompense because they can & because they will be broke in 6 months.They probably have it in mind now & don't need your help.

Your not part of it so stay out of it please.

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