The Greyhound-Data Forum has been created to act as a platform for greyhound enthusiasts to share information on this magnificent animal called a greyhound.
Greyhound-Data reserve the right to remove any post that is off topic, advertisements or opinions they consider to be offensive.
If you answer then please try to stay on topic. It's absolutely okay to answer in a broader scope but don't hijack posts by switching to something off topic.
In case you see an insulting post: DO NOT REPLY TO IT!
Use the report button to inform the moderators so that we can delete it.
Geoff Collins Australia (Verified User) Posts 2010 Dogs 291 / Races 30 12 Jun 2014 22:11
(0)
(0)
The US May/June 2014 service numbers are out and heres the top 10 most used sires in the States during that time Djays Octane 48 KC And All 22 Flying Coal City 21 Kiowa Mon Manny 19 Kiowa Sweet Trey 16 BDs Grayson 15 Flying Hydrogen 12 Dragon Fire 11 Pat C Clement 10 Last Outlaw 9 Trent Lee 9 Venus Espinosa 9
Michael Barry Australia (Verified User) Posts 7402 Dogs 26 / Races 9 12 Jun 2014 22:25
(0)
(0)
trent lee, is a sire i feel could have been used here at lot more than he was, he produced some good dogs from a small number of litters to race here, and he is a track record holder at derby lane CLICK HERE
Michael Bowerman Australia (Verified User) Posts 4614 Dogs 11 / Races 0 12 Jun 2014 23:46
(0)
(0)
Geoff Collins wrote:
The US May/June 2014 service numbers are out and heres the top 10 most used sires in the States during that time Djays Octane 48 KC And All 22 Flying Coal City 21 Kiowa Mon Manny 19 Kiowa Sweet Trey 16 BDs Grayson 15 Flying Hydrogen 12 Dragon Fire 11 Pat C Clement 10 Last Outlaw 9 Trent Lee 9 Venus Espinosa 9
that is a massive suport for djays octane,
Wayne Osullivan Ireland (Verified User) Posts 2414 Dogs 3 / Races 0 13 Jun 2014 07:31
(0)
(0)
Its amazing that the Americans are not using Kinloch Brae considering he is servicing roughly 200 bitches per year elsewhere.
Darren Langley Australia (Verified User) Posts 3159 Dogs 12 / Races 0 13 Jun 2014 23:07
(0)
(0)
michael bowerman wrote:
Geoff Collins wrote:
The US May/June 2014 service numbers are out and heres the top 10 most used sires in the States during that time Djays Octane 48 KC And All 22 Flying Coal City 21 Kiowa Mon Manny 19 Kiowa Sweet Trey 16 BDs Grayson 15 Flying Hydrogen 12 Dragon Fire 11 Pat C Clement 10 Last Outlaw 9 Trent Lee 9 Venus Espinosa 9
that is a massive suport for djays octane,
That is a big difference. That's double the next best he ,it's be throwing some nice, fast pups.
Kevin Wright Australia (Verified User) Posts 5708 Dogs 1 / Races 1 14 Jun 2014 00:06
(0)
(0)
The US May/June 2014 service numbers
1. DJAYS OCTANE - 48 2. KC AND ALL - 22 3. FLYING COAL CITY - 21 4. KIOWA MON MANNY - 19 5. KIOWA SWEET TREY - 16 6. BD'S GRAYSON - 15 7. FLYING HYDROGEN - 12 8. DRAGON FIRE - 11 9. PAT C CLEMENT - 10 10. LAST OUTLAW - 9 10.) TRENT LEE - 9 10.) VENUS ESPINOSA - 9 13. LONESOME CRY - 8 14. BELLA INFRARED - 7 14.) CRAIGIE WHISTLER - 7 16.) GABLE SOUR CREAM - 6 16,) HI NOON HERO - 6 16.) SH AVATAR - 6 16.) SWITZLERS JAMMIN - 6 16.) TYRUR ALEX - 6 21.) FLUPASCRACKERBOX - 5 21.) FLYING PENSKE - 5 21.) NMS SWEET THING -5 21.) OSHKOSH SLAMMER - 5 21.) SMOKY JOE - 5 21.) TK QUICK STRIKE - 5 21.) WW 'S DOG GONE - 5 28.) AMF EX PRESIDENT - 4 28.) BARCELONA BOSS - 4 28.) FLYIN MAN OF GOD - 4 28.) GS COMET - 4 28.) KIOWA MYTH - 4 28.) KIOWA WW BROTHER - 4 28.) LK'S NOW R NEVER - 4 28. ) OSWALD COBBLEPOT - 4 28.) P'S GIBBS - 4 28.) SUPER LEE - 4 28. ) TIGER BOY - 4 28.) TMC'S REMEDY - 4 40.) ATASCOCITA BOWL - 3 40.) BONAFIDE TOP DOG - 3 40.) COLDWATER KONOW - 3 40.) DEFRIM BALE - 3 40.) DODGEM BY DESIGN - 3 40. ) GABLE DODGE - 3 40.) GOODLUCKSTERLING - 3 40.) KIOWA CRUZECHAMP - 3 40.) LOOK MY WAY - 3 40.) ROUGH HUSTLE - 3 40.) SOPRANO DRIVE - 3 40.) TMC'S REMEDY - 3
Very interesting statistics but this will change month to month .
I put together some interesting statistics for you all.
Top 39 Sires on that list
All Americans 13
............................. Sons at stud 3 Gable dodge son's...Gable dodge Date of birth 2 DEC 1995 dec Kc and All Lonesome Cry Flying man of god
Kiowa Sweet trey date of birth 7 JAN 2000 dec 3 son's Flying Hydrogen Flying Coal City ...All American P's Gibbs
Kiowa Mon Manny Date of birth 18 SEP 2002 alive and kicking
4 sons at stud on the present list AMF Ex President...All American SH Avatar......All American Bella Infared......All American Venus Espinosa...All American
Sire Lines of Flying Penske 15 sons The Very best producing son of flying Penske is by far Kiowa Mon Manny ...
Darren Langley Australia (Verified User) Posts 3159 Dogs 12 / Races 0 14 Jun 2014 00:16
(0)
(0)
kevin wright wrote:
The US May/June 2014 service numbers
1. DJAYS OCTANE - 48 2. KC AND ALL - 22 3. FLYING COAL CITY - 21 4. KIOWA MON MANNY - 19 5. KIOWA SWEET TREY - 16 6. BD'S GRAYSON - 15 7. FLYING HYDROGEN - 12 8. DRAGON FIRE - 11 9. PAT C CLEMENT - 10 10. LAST OUTLAW - 9 10.) TRENT LEE - 9 10.) VENUS ESPINOSA - 9 13. LONESOME CRY - 8 14. BELLA INFRARED - 7 14.) CRAIGIE WHISTLER - 7 16.) GABLE SOUR CREAM - 6 16,) HI NOON HERO - 6 16.) SH AVATAR - 6 16.) SWITZLERS JAMMIN - 6 16.) TYRUR ALEX - 6 21.) FLUPASCRACKERBOX - 5 21.) FLYING PENSKE - 5 21.) NMS SWEET THING -5 21.) OSHKOSH SLAMMER - 5 21.) SMOKY JOE - 5 21.) TK QUICK STRIKE - 5 21.) WW 'S DOG GONE - 5 28.) AMF EX PRESIDENT - 4 28.) BARCELONA BOSS - 4 28.) FLYIN MAN OF GOD - 4 28.) GS COMET - 4 28.) KIOWA MYTH - 4 28.) KIOWA WW BROTHER - 4 28.) LK'S NOW R NEVER - 4 28. ) OSWALD COBBLEPOT - 4 28.) P'S GIBBS - 4 28.) SUPER LEE - 4 28. ) TIGER BOY - 4 28.) TMC'S REMEDY - 4 40.) ATASCOCITA BOWL - 3 40.) BONAFIDE TOP DOG - 3 40.) COLDWATER KONOW - 3 40.) DEFRIM BALE - 3 40.) DODGEM BY DESIGN - 3 40. ) GABLE DODGE - 3 40.) GOODLUCKSTERLING - 3 40.) KIOWA CRUZECHAMP - 3 40.) LOOK MY WAY - 3 40.) ROUGH HUSTLE - 3 40.) SOPRANO DRIVE - 3 40.) TMC'S REMEDY - 3
Very interesting statistics but this will change month to month .
I put together some interesting statistics for you all.
Top 39 Sires on that list
All Americans 13
............................. Sons at stud 3 Gable dodge son's...Gable dodge Date of birth 2 DEC 1995 dec Kc and All Lonesome Cry Flying man of god
Kiowa Sweet trey date of birth 7 JAN 2000 dec 3 son's Flying Hydrogen Flying Coal City ...All American P's Gibbs
Kiowa Mon Manny Date of birth 18 SEP 2002 alive and kicking
4 sons at stud on the present list AMF Ex President...All American SH Avatar......All American Bella Infared......All American Venus Espinosa...All American
Sire Lines of Flying Penske 15 sons The Very best producing son of flying Penske is by far Kiowa Mon Manny ...
Kevin there's must be a good reason why this bloke has doubled the number of bitches than the next best stud dog. Fact is he's very popular with breeders and im sure the Aussie breeders will follow.
James Saunders Australia (Verified User) Posts 4644 Dogs 3 / Races 3 14 Jun 2014 00:20
(0)
(0)
Darren i think there whole system is different than ours and track records,sire stats and virtually everything is not comparable too what we understand as greyhound racing.In OZ yes twice as many breedings to one sire would indicate that dog to be the peoples choice of top stud but as i say everythings different over there and stats dont mean as much.I noticed not one pup advertised in the classifieds from the U.S.
Kevin Wright Australia (Verified User) Posts 5708 Dogs 1 / Races 1 14 Jun 2014 00:29
(0)
(0)
Darren .. DJAYS OCTANE has been used by the biggest kennels in the USA and he has had some of the best broods along the way and good luck to him and his owner.
KIOWA MON MANNY.... has had to work his way up from the bottom and he has well and truly proved what a champion sire he is and his Daughters are now becoming the MUST HAVE BROODS.
I guess you could look at things like this .
Two dogs one owned by Jason Thompson One owned by myself .. I struggle to get thirty forty bitches but Jason being the Stud master he is can get 200 bitches and thats just the way things happen so already his Sire has a huge jump on the competition . This takes place in every Country and for a dog to work his way up is a huge achievement and should not be over looked at all .
Darren Langley Australia (Verified User) Posts 3159 Dogs 12 / Races 0 14 Jun 2014 00:36
(0)
(0)
kevin wright wrote:
Darren .. DJAYS OCTANE has been used by the biggest kennels in the USA and he has had some of the best broods along the way and good luck to him and his owner.
KIOWA MON MANNY.... has had to work his way up from the bottom and he has well and truly proved what a champion sire he is and his Daughters are now becoming the MUST HAVE BROODS.
I guess you could look at things like this .
Two dogs one owned by Jason Thompson One owned by myself .. I struggle to get thirty forty bitches but Jason being the Stud master he is can get 200 bitches and thats just the way things happen so already his Sire has a huge jump on the competition . This takes place in every Country and for a dog to work his way up is a huge achievement and should not be over looked at all .
Oh ok so Djays just been lucky then..... Was Collision lucky as well?? Sorry mate I stick to facts
So your saying if you had Collision at stud he wouldn't have been that successful?
As breeders we don't look at sentimental values we look facts. We could say that about 50%plus of stud dogs not getting a go in OZ but the facts are the ones that are at the top are there for a reason
Darren Langley Australia (Verified User) Posts 3159 Dogs 12 / Races 0 14 Jun 2014 00:38
(0)
(0)
james saunders wrote:
Darren i think there whole system is different than ours and track records,sire stats and virtually everything is not comparable too what we understand as greyhound racing.In OZ yes twice as many breedings to one sire would indicate that dog to be the peoples choice of top stud but as i say everythings different over there and stats dont mean as much.I noticed not one pup advertised in the classifieds from the U.S.
James I do agree he must be the people's choice but there must be a reason for that??
Kevin Wright Australia (Verified User) Posts 5708 Dogs 1 / Races 1 14 Jun 2014 00:49
(0)
(0)
darren langley wrote:
kevin wright wrote:
Darren .. DJAYS OCTANE has been used by the biggest kennels in the USA and he has had some of the best broods along the way and good luck to him and his owner.
KIOWA MON MANNY.... has had to work his way up from the bottom and he has well and truly proved what a champion sire he is and his Daughters are now becoming the MUST HAVE BROODS.
I guess you could look at things like this .
Two dogs one owned by Jason Thompson One owned by myself .. I struggle to get thirty forty bitches but Jason being the Stud master he is can get 200 bitches and thats just the way things happen so already his Sire has a huge jump on the competition . This takes place in every Country and for a dog to work his way up is a huge achievement and should not be over looked at all .
Oh ok so Djays just been lucky then..... Was Collision lucky as well?? Sorry mate I stick to facts
So your saying if you had Collision at stud he wouldn't have been that successful?
As breeders we don't look at sentimental values we look facts. We could say that about 50%plus of stud dogs not getting a go in OZ but the facts are the ones that are at the top are there for a reason
Darren once again you fail to read any facts how things work with the Sires in the USA and these facts have been told many many times by a lot of different people the facts are there is ONE and only ONE best Sire of stud dogs who carry the the Flying Penske sire line . There could be a time when Kiowa Mon Manny is knocked off as Flying Penske's best son and it COULD be Djays Octane but we will have to wait a couple of years for us to see if it happen at all. Djays Octane is a great up and coming Sire and I wish his owners the very best but if you want facts then get a new pair of glasses and then do your own research and you will see how things really are. You want facts I give you facts but it's no good if you have your eye's half closed .
Darren Langley Australia (Verified User) Posts 3159 Dogs 12 / Races 0 14 Jun 2014 01:00
(0)
(0)
kevin wright wrote:
darren langley wrote:
kevin wright wrote:
Darren .. DJAYS OCTANE has been used by the biggest kennels in the USA and he has had some of the best broods along the way and good luck to him and his owner.
KIOWA MON MANNY.... has had to work his way up from the bottom and he has well and truly proved what a champion sire he is and his Daughters are now becoming the MUST HAVE BROODS.
I guess you could look at things like this .
Two dogs one owned by Jason Thompson One owned by myself .. I struggle to get thirty forty bitches but Jason being the Stud master he is can get 200 bitches and thats just the way things happen so already his Sire has a huge jump on the competition . This takes place in every Country and for a dog to work his way up is a huge achievement and should not be over looked at all .
Oh ok so Djays just been lucky then..... Was Collision lucky as well?? Sorry mate I stick to facts
So your saying if you had Collision at stud he wouldn't have been that successful?
As breeders we don't look at sentimental values we look facts. We could say that about 50%plus of stud dogs not getting a go in OZ but the facts are the ones that are at the top are there for a reason
Darren once again you fail to read any facts how things work with the Sires in the USA and these facts have been told many many times by a lot of different people the facts are there is ONE and only ONE best Sire of stud dogs who carry the the Flying Penske sire line . There could be a time when Kiowa Mon Manny is knocked off as Flying Penske's best son and it COULD be Djays Octane but we will have to wait a couple of years for us to see if it happen at all. Djays Octane is a great up and coming Sire and I wish his owners the very best but if you want facts then get a new pair of glasses and then do your own research and you will see how things really are. You want facts I give you facts but it's no good if you have your eye's half closed .
No worries Kev. I think Geoff provided us with the facts.
Kev how about sticking to the topic. Which is who is the busiest USA sire and I think Geoff gave us the top 20odd and Djays doubled the next stud dog.
So not sure how I have my eyes half closed. Unless I'm reading it wrong.
Aussie breeders are smart enough to know who's hot and who not in the USA stud game.
Kevin Wright Australia (Verified User) Posts 5708 Dogs 1 / Races 1 14 Jun 2014 01:05
(0)
(0)
darren langley wrote:
kevin wright wrote:
darren langley wrote:
kevin wright wrote:
Darren .. DJAYS OCTANE has been used by the biggest kennels in the USA and he has had some of the best broods along the way and good luck to him and his owner.
KIOWA MON MANNY.... has had to work his way up from the bottom and he has well and truly proved what a champion sire he is and his Daughters are now becoming the MUST HAVE BROODS.
I guess you could look at things like this .
Two dogs one owned by Jason Thompson One owned by myself .. I struggle to get thirty forty bitches but Jason being the Stud master he is can get 200 bitches and thats just the way things happen so already his Sire has a huge jump on the competition . This takes place in every Country and for a dog to work his way up is a huge achievement and should not be over looked at all .
Oh ok so Djays just been lucky then..... Was Collision lucky as well?? Sorry mate I stick to facts
So your saying if you had Collision at stud he wouldn't have been that successful?
As breeders we don't look at sentimental values we look facts. We could say that about 50%plus of stud dogs not getting a go in OZ but the facts are the ones that are at the top are there for a reason
Darren once again you fail to read any facts how things work with the Sires in the USA and these facts have been told many many times by a lot of different people the facts are there is ONE and only ONE best Sire of stud dogs who carry the the Flying Penske sire line . There could be a time when Kiowa Mon Manny is knocked off as Flying Penske's best son and it COULD be Djays Octane but we will have to wait a couple of years for us to see if it happen at all. Djays Octane is a great up and coming Sire and I wish his owners the very best but if you want facts then get a new pair of glasses and then do your own research and you will see how things really are. You want facts I give you facts but it's no good if you have your eye's half closed .
No worries Kev. I think Geoff provided us with the facts.
Kev how about sticking to the topic. Which is who is the busiest USA sire and I think Geoff gave us the top 20odd and Djays doubled the next stud dog.
So not sure how I have my eyes half closed. Unless I'm reading it wrong.
Aussie breeders are smart enough to know who's hot and who not in the USA stud game.
Darren you want facts so I gave some more facts not just the top 20 sires and I also gave you FACTS about what sires have what SONS at stud on that list .. I also added what dogs on that list were ALL AMERICANS and it just happened to be Kiowa Mon Manny who has produced those four Sons who stand at stud . Now how can you say those facts are not relevant to this thread .
Geoff Collins Australia (Verified User) Posts 2010 Dogs 291 / Races 30 14 Jun 2014 01:09
(0)
(0)
kevin wright wrote:
Darren .. DJAYS OCTANE has been used by the biggest kennels in the USA and he has had some of the best broods along the way and good luck to him and his owner.
KIOWA MON MANNY.... has had to work his way up from the bottom and he has well and truly proved what a champion sire he is and his Daughters are now becoming the MUST HAVE BROODS.
I guess you could look at things like this .
Two dogs one owned by Jason Thompson One owned by myself .. I struggle to get thirty forty bitches but Jason being the Stud master he is can get 200 bitches and thats just the way things happen so already his Sire has a huge jump on the competition . This takes place in every Country and for a dog to work his way up is a huge achievement and should not be over looked at all .
Kevin thats not correct he did not get the best bitches nor the biggest breeders DJO only had 64 pups born in his first year at stud and only 129 pups born in his second year but his results were outstanding from those limited matings and thats why hes so busy now .. he had 522 pups whelped in his third year and my guess is he will have close on 1800/2000 pups on the ground in the last 12 months. The US breeders I speak to are flocking to the dog because they cant wait to see what he throws with the better class bitches.
Dave Lonergan Ireland (Verified User) Posts 3410 Dogs 18 / Races 0 14 Jun 2014 01:30
(0)
(0)
wayne osullivan wrote:
Its amazing that the Americans are not using Kinloch Brae considering he is servicing roughly 200 bitches per year elsewhere.
might be the middle distance versus long distance thing Wayne
Kevin Wright Australia (Verified User) Posts 5708 Dogs 1 / Races 1 14 Jun 2014 01:36
(0)
(0)
Dave Lonergan wrote:
wayne osullivan wrote:
Its amazing that the Americans are not using Kinloch Brae considering he is servicing roughly 200 bitches per year elsewhere.
might be the middle distance versus long distance thing Wayne
Dave I guess Kinloch Brae throws Box speed dogs who the US don't use so much for Southland and today the US breeders are looking at DJays Octane who throws not so much a blistering box dog but a run on type dog who hits the line hard .
Horse's for courses when it comes to dogs that suit the US tracks
Paul Horig Bahamas (Verified User) Posts 222 Dogs 10 / Races 0 14 Jun 2014 01:50
(0)
(0)
darren langley wrote:
james saunders wrote:
Darren i think there whole system is different than ours and track records,sire stats and virtually everything is not comparable too what we understand as greyhound racing.In OZ yes twice as many breedings to one sire would indicate that dog to be the peoples choice of top stud but as i say everythings different over there and stats dont mean as much.I noticed not one pup advertised in the classifieds from the U.S.
James I do agree he must be the people's choice but there must be a reason for that??
Darren,
He looks to be a very fertile greyhound. Some of the other studs are getting old and their fertility is probably waning. A miss or small litter is always bad for a breeder. A younger up and coming sire is a attractive option over the aging warrior.
James Saunders Australia (Verified User) Posts 4644 Dogs 3 / Races 3 14 Jun 2014 01:54
Darren Langley Australia (Verified User) Posts 3159 Dogs 12 / Races 0 14 Jun 2014 02:55
(0)
(0)
Geoff Collins wrote:
kevin wright wrote:
Darren .. DJAYS OCTANE has been used by the biggest kennels in the USA and he has had some of the best broods along the way and good luck to him and his owner.
KIOWA MON MANNY.... has had to work his way up from the bottom and he has well and truly proved what a champion sire he is and his Daughters are now becoming the MUST HAVE BROODS.
I guess you could look at things like this .
Two dogs one owned by Jason Thompson One owned by myself .. I struggle to get thirty forty bitches but Jason being the Stud master he is can get 200 bitches and thats just the way things happen so already his Sire has a huge jump on the competition . This takes place in every Country and for a dog to work his way up is a huge achievement and should not be over looked at all .
Kevin thats not correct he did not get the best bitches nor the biggest breeders DJO only had 64 pups born in his first year at stud and only 129 pups born in his second year but his results were outstanding from those limited matings and thats why hes so busy now .. he had 522 pups whelped in his third year and my guess is he will have close on 1800/2000 pups on the ground in the last 12 months. The US breeders I speak to are flocking to the dog because they cant wait to see what he throws with the better class bitches.
Geoff thanks for providing the facts. I do try to see things with eyes wide open but seems people want to blur the facts
there does seem to have a buzz around this dog and if all theses figures are correct I can see why.
Thanks Geoff for keeping us informed about this dog
Do you have questions about breeding theories? 
