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Calum Andersen Australia (Verified User) Posts 913 Dogs 5 / Races 1 08 Feb 2018 21:13
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What are peoples opinions on breeding with a bitch that has faught? Is there a tendency to throw that on?
Matt Griffiths Australia (Verified User) Posts 1950 Dogs 55 / Races 2 08 Feb 2018 21:49
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They can throw fighting, but probably not much more likely to throw a fighter than any other broodie. If she had ability it wouldn't stop me from breeding providing the rest of the litter were honest chasers.
Tony Digiorgio Australia (Verified User) Posts 1006 Dogs 25 / Races 0 08 Feb 2018 21:54
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If you've got surplus money and you're breeding to race then go ahead. But if you are intending to sell some of the pups you may have trouble because fighting convictions are easily traced on the various greyhound sites.
Calum Andersen Australia (Verified User) Posts 913 Dogs 5 / Races 1 09 Feb 2018 00:50
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Tony Digiorgio wrote:
If you've got surplus money and you're breeding to race then go ahead. But if you are intending to sell some of the pups you may have trouble because fighting convictions are easily traced on the various greyhound sites.
I definantly wouldnt sell as i have a fear that if i do then the best one will not be in my hands to race.
Matt James wrote:
They can throw fighting, but probably not much more likely to throw a fighter than any other broodie. If she had ability it wouldn't stop me from breeding providing the rest of the litter were honest chasers.
She is number 4 in her litter to fight but i blame the sire(shakey jakey) as the first was by bit chilli and have had 200 odd starts from the 3 pups and none have looked like turning their head. One even got faught almost to a stop and was still trying to run.(rosie has run third on a thursday the last 2 weeks) but this bitch would give her a start and a sincere beating one out.
Carole Brown Australia (Verified User) Posts 32355 Dogs 185 / Races 2 09 Feb 2018 01:41
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Calum, I know what you have said about the litter, but is she on any season suppressant ? If she is, this could be a reason why.
Matt Griffiths Australia (Verified User) Posts 1950 Dogs 55 / Races 2 09 Feb 2018 03:51
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Yeah Shakey Jakey's are known for it.
If you not planning on selling any and know she could run you should be right if you go to a sire that's known for his relaxed attitude. because of the added outcross to dilute the bloodlines id be going with CLICK HERE Or a sire that's known for chase like CLICK HERECLICK HERE
John Staines Australia (Verified User) Posts 3490 Dogs 945 / Races 0 09 Feb 2018 08:29
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zarbo was a fighter and look at her litters.
Rob Horne Australia (Verified User) Posts 522 Dogs 1 / Races 3 09 Feb 2018 09:32
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Elusive rebel?
Matt Griffiths Australia (Verified User) Posts 1950 Dogs 55 / Races 2 09 Feb 2018 09:44
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I think the general consensus is go with your gut and give her a chance. And let's be honest most litters in this day and age will have 1 or 2 that slip up in one way or another, it just depends if the stewards deem they deserve a ticket or not.
Tudor Dinu Andrei Romania (Verified User) Posts 62 Dogs 0 / Races 0 09 Feb 2018 15:29
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@Matt. How many pups out of Shakey Jakey where fighters? You know that every greyhound has more than half genes inherited from the dam side... so how can anyone tell that the sire is to blame for a fighting incident? Or the dam?
John Marriott United Kingdom (Verified User) Posts 581 Dogs 24 / Races 4 10 Feb 2018 12:18
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calum andersen wrote:
What are peoples opinions on breeding with a bitch that has faught? Is there a tendency to throw that on?
Breeding from bitches that fight or don't chase is madness Calum. Why not find a brood bitch that is a hard chaser ?
calum andersen wrote:
She is number 4 in her litter to fight
The fact that she is "number 4" in her litter to fight should have alarm bells ringing.
Plenty will tell you that 'xyz' fought and threw a good one.
The FACTS are, that having gone through a few stud books checking the offspring from bitches that fought... only 1 in 3 actually make the track, and even then, some of those fight. Put the percentages in your favour rather than trying to defy them.
Ryan Vanderwert Australia (Verified User) Posts 5947 Dogs 8 / Races 0 11 Feb 2018 04:06
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Hi Calum,
Whilst I wld generally agree with what John M is saying, I remember rating PS between July and September last year as a consistent 30.50 bitch at Albion who used to ease off dogs especially early in a race rather than being an overly aggressive type that wld bail up a dog, and with the added lack of incentive afforded to dogs to chase these days............anyway she may be an exception from that general black/white rule of not breeding with bitches that fight.
If you were to breed her I wld look to replicate linebreeding angles of previous successes from that line, such as a Mr Gibson or a Reggekate type, that won plenty of races.
g/l luck if you go ahead.
Calum Andersen Australia (Verified User) Posts 913 Dogs 5 / Races 1 11 Feb 2018 06:32
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Ryan Vanderwert wrote:
Hi Calum, I remember rating PS between July and September last year as a consistent 30.50 bitch at Albion who used to ease off dogs especially early in a race rather than being an overly aggressive type that wld bail up a dog.
Thanks mate. I cant dissagree 1 bit with what youve said of her. Generally she is a very laid back bitch. She had 2 goes on the finish on lure and didnt want a bar of it. Ran to the outside fence and waited for me 15yards from another dog when it came to a stop. The run at grafton was baffling because she had has plenty of chances to fight back in the ruck in other races. Id always given her a better chance as a 600m+ dog rather than a 520m dog.
Carole Brown Australia (Verified User) Posts 32355 Dogs 185 / Races 2 11 Feb 2018 09:03
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Calum, just out of interest, did you see my question above ?
Paul Gebhard United Kingdom (Verified User) Posts 329 Dogs 597 / Races 79 11 Feb 2018 09:05
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john marriott wrote:
calum andersen wrote:
What are peoples opinions on breeding with a bitch that has faught? Is there a tendency to throw that on?
Breeding from bitches that fight or don't chase is madness Calum. Why not find a brood bitch that is a hard chaser ?
calum andersen wrote:
She is number 4 in her litter to fight
The fact that she is "number 4" in her litter to fight should have alarm bells ringing.
Plenty will tell you that 'xyz' fought and threw a good one.
The FACTS are, that having gone through a few stud books checking the offspring from bitches that fought... only 1 in 3 actually make the track, and even then, some of those fight. Put the percentages in your favour rather than trying to defy them.
Theres different levels of fighting though isnt there?
I think you have to dig a bit deeper than that
Personally itd be the total non chaser that Id avoid even if its from a superstar litter, I think its much more likely that its offspring wont chase either
Cheers
Michael Geraghty Australia (Verified User) Posts 4138 Dogs 14 / Races 15 11 Feb 2018 09:22
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Mr. Anderson, You will get a hundred different reasons why you should, and why you shouldn't. At the end of the day, YOU know the bitch and it is YOU who will either pay or play.
Speaking from experience, I bred with a fighter. She had over 30 pups...one fought, and fought it did...Mike Tyson would have been proud. The others DIDN'T. I've bred 2nd generation...no fighters. I'm more than happy to breed 3rd generation. The foundation bitch WAS NOT from a proven catty line.
I've spoken to plenty of people who had a dog fight "out of no-where." I ask had it shown a tendency before...NO. Did the mother fight?...NO. Sire not known for fighters. I've also spoken to people who said YES...the mother was iffy, or YES, the sire was getting its fair share of skunks.
Well, I reckon I have the answer, and it's a pretty bloody simple one... THEY'RE DOGS!!!!! Dogs work on two basic instincts when it comes to this...Fight or Flight. At any one time, ALL dogs have the potential to do either...ALL. Put them in a situation physically or mentally and they will react in either way.
Some lines will throw stronger instincts of either and that becomes harder to combat.
FWIW, if your bitch is not from a proven nonnies or fighting line, go for it. If she IS, and the others that fought in her litter are indicative of the line, find her a home and find something else.
More than ever, you need "run through brick walls" litters, who chase little pathetic synthetic mops like demons.
Good luck mate.
Patrick D'Arcy Australia (Verified User) Posts 188 Dogs 3 / Races 0 11 Feb 2018 17:24
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Michael Geraghty wrote:
Mr. Anderson, You will get a hundred different reasons why you should, and why you shouldn't. At the end of the day, YOU know the bitch and it is YOU who will either pay or play.
Speaking from experience, I bred with a fighter. She had over 30 pups...one fought, and fought it did...Mike Tyson would have been proud. The others DIDN'T. I've bred 2nd generation...no fighters. I'm more than happy to breed 3rd generation. The foundation bitch WAS NOT from a proven catty line.
I've spoken to plenty of people who had a dog fight "out of no-where." I ask had it shown a tendency before...NO. Did the mother fight?...NO. Sire not known for fighters. I've also spoken to people who said YES...the mother was iffy, or YES, the sire was getting its fair share of skunks.
Well, I reckon I have the answer, and it's a pretty bloody simple one... THEY'RE DOGS!!!!! Dogs work on two basic instincts when it comes to this...Fight or Flight. At any one time, ALL dogs have the potential to do either...ALL. Put them in a situation physically or mentally and they will react in either way.
Some lines will throw stronger instincts of either and that becomes harder to combat.
FWIW, if your bitch is not from a proven nonnies or fighting line, go for it. If she IS, and the others that fought in her litter are indicative of the line, find her a home and find something else.
More than ever, you need "run through brick walls" litters, who chase little pathetic synthetic mops like demons.
Good luck mate.
What Michael said.... Btw could you give Carole the courtesy of an answer to her question?
Calum Andersen Australia (Verified User) Posts 913 Dogs 5 / Races 1 12 Feb 2018 03:22
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Carole Brown wrote:
Calum, just out of interest, did you see my question above ?
Sorry carole i forgot to reply. No no seasonal suppressant. I dont like to use them.
Michael Geraghty Australia (Verified User) Posts 4138 Dogs 14 / Races 15 12 Feb 2018 04:22
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"No no seasonal suppressant. I dont like to use them."
Do they make you go a bit sour, Calum?
Calum Andersen Australia (Verified User) Posts 913 Dogs 5 / Races 1 12 Feb 2018 09:36
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Michael Geraghty wrote:
"No no seasonal suppressant. I dont like to use them."