Whilst I acknowledge Kinloch Brae himself cannot pass on Elsie Moss' genes/dna from his pedigree thru the x chrome to his future male offspring, there is no genetic evidence that genes/dna from Elsie Moss' x chromosome have not effected the litter which includes this years half a $M Golden Easter Egg winner Simply Limelight.

Furthermore the primary linebreeding in the x path to Elsie Moss is a 7 x 11 cross thru different individuals and litterm8's Max Moss on Kinloch Brae's side of the ped (behind Montague Memory 5th gen) and;

on the dam side the 11x cross to Elsie Moss is thru Fine Legend's sire New Tears on the dam Guiding Light's damline, thru to Elsie Moss with Max Moss' brother Mister Moss.

For those who want to say the %'s are that low 11 gens back are simply assuming that the genetics work mathematically but with this pedigree there doesn't appear to be any other primary linebreeding of genetically theoretical significance.

So if the success of this litter's pedigree is not primary linebreeding in the x path thru different individuals as close as 6/7 gens back to a cornerstone brood from a valid genetic/breeding theory standpoint, then what is it ?

N.B. This is the very reason I believe Kinloch Brae was such a successful outcross with so many broods in Aus simply because nothing else stands out from a valid genetic/breeding theory standpoint. Cheers.

KB and his mostly USA pedigree added the strength / hybrid vigour !

It's a tragedy that Lightnin' Ethics a very fast sister to simply limelight died prematurely !

I'm not disputing what you are saying Mark, however wld like to see some nos and breeding logic as to why something is possibly occuring within a pedigree to back up what you are saying, otherwise it's just heresay isn't it ?

Again nothing wrong if you want to run with what you are saying but more genetic/theoretical 'evidence' such as what I'm saying may allow you to pull the percentages your way ? Cheers.

Always after the fact, of course.

Why wasn't this useful information posted the day before the race, rather than the day after?

Surely, some credit should be given to the breeder, rearer, trainer to produce a finely tuned dog that produced it's best on the night.

Can someone tell us which dog will win the first at Nowra today and why?

The only conclusion you can make with certainty is that the mating worked !!!

How does your Elsie Moss theory look with her Fernando Bale litter and future Superior Panama litter?

Box 3

Hows that box 2 Vinnys Charm is the same Fair Hazard dam line as this topics Simply Limelight.

For a bit of fun:-

2. Vinnys Charm shares pedigree traits with the likes of Smooth Fancy and Fancy Liza and reinforces the pedigree of sire Mepunga Blazer and more distantly the success of his top offspring.

7. Wavering Light shares pedigree traits with French Martini.

6. Bowen Drive while inbred picks up on the pedigree of Throttle

5. Winsome Camilla has the reverse cross of Ebby Jet Power

1. Miss Spoke bred on plenty of Fernando elite crosses

Interestingly Darren, Superior Panama carries Max Moss' litter sister Pearl Moss thru Mi Designer in the 4th gen of SP's ped in the x path which means when mated Elsie Moss is in the 10th gen. Not as close up as Max Moss in Kinloch Brae's ped but nonetheless the linebreeding in the x path to Elsie Moss is present. Here they both are at work in x in the All American's ped https:/ CLICK HERE .

I've had a quick look at Chloe Allen's ped in x and neither Max Moss nor Pearl Moss appear in that path.

Thx for somewhat taking the topic seriously.
================================================================
Agree Mark it has nicked and x path is what's apparent. Easy to locate the linebreeding, Kinloch Brae being an outcross. Cheers.

Thats why I dont watch, nor punt on 300m racing LOL

But, doesnt Elsie Moss appear a good 7x in x through Chloe Allen? The difference the descendants, merely what was sent to the U.S. and what remained at home.

If anything your theory, might be best suited through the presence in outcross sires? Especially if Superior Panama works again, like Kinloch Brae did? Complimenting, rather than intensifying?

1. Only thru the same individual Mister Moss in x as far as I can see.
To create 100% intensity in x there need to be litterm8's top and bottom of the ped, i.e. different individuals specifically from the Which Chariot x Elsie Moss litter and both in the x path, such as Max Moss and Mister Moss in Simply Limelight's litter.

Or if you are looking at Superior Panama x Guiding light it will be Pearl Moss in x in the top half of the ped and Mister Moss in x in the bottom half of Guiding Light's ped. It's really easy to spot the intense linebreeding if there is an outcross present.

With Fernando Bale x Guiding Light there is no Pearl Moss or Max Moss in the x path in the top half of the ped to have a chance for that pedigree to ignite or create vigour thru those different individuals from the same litter.
Mister Moss top and bottom such as with the Fernando mating doesn't create new vigour because it's the same individual.

2. It shldn't matter if it's an outcross or not . It's easier to find the linebreeding thru different individuals from the same litter with outcrosses. It's the same principle.

Snow Report - https:/ CLICK HERE

Proper Tears - https:/ CLICK HERE

Little Denver - https:/ CLICK HERE

The whole idea of creating vigour within a ped comes from linbreeding thru different individuals with the same blood, i.e. bringing related individuals top and bottom half together in a pedigree. If you linebreed thru the same individual such as with your Snow Report example, the thought is that you arguably aren't creating anything new within the ped, linebreeding Mister Moss in that manner.

"HEAD HONCHO" is a classic example !

https:/ CLICK HERE

Zulu Zeus also !

Line breeding to Superior Hounds is the KEY !

Fernando Bale and Barcia Bale will soon appear in pedigrees at 18.8% and 25%

Just like Temlee, Waverly Supreme, Brother Fox did with great success

Only outcross when necessary !

Yes line breeding to litter mates that were Superior Hounds works, Nation Parade was faster than his Sister Promises Free !

In addition to that his grand dams sire is Brett Lee. If you put Brett Lee over his sires dam Kiacatoo Pearl and look at the Blood Quota table below https:/ CLICK HERE you'll find that Kiacatoo Pearl carries different individuals in her pedigree that make up 94% of Brett Lee's pedigree within 5 gens.

So there's a huge amount of Brett Lee influence in Burn One Down's ped apart from what's obvious on the front page.

I wld generally agree with most of what you said, I just dunno about the logical significance of that 18.8% fig tho. lol. Cheers.