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Sean O'Donnell Australia (Verified User) Posts 4262 Dogs 64 / Races 54 18 Jun 2012 08:32
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what are peoples thoughts on this sire i know darren macdonald has some frozen in country for bitches on season i wonder if anyone knows of his racing style, reports on offspring!
Vicki May Caldwell Australia (Verified User) Posts 1518 Dogs 17 / Races 16 18 Jun 2012 08:56
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kinloch brae is a complet outcross to w.o,w and one would think you would be breeding for future brood bitchs as there aint no genetic link, but thats me thinking , if i had her id be looking this way
CLICK HERE he will bring her best blood back via brett lee and glamarous, but we as breeders all think diffrently and as for kinloch brae he has allready produced a ire derby winner and comes from the one of the best producing lines in the usa and now working great in aust via the destini broods,
Grant Thomas Australia (Verified User) Posts 11447 Dogs 64 / Races 20 18 Jun 2012 09:50
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As VICKI says, he has a nice one in Derby winner...
CLICK HERE Genetic link is way back though VICKI...
Via supreme fun x octum on the 6th line both sides via laurdella fun x waverly supreme. Sean she will make a valuable brood in future to the right sires..breed to get race dogs nit brood bitchs.. Wheres pedro would be 1st pick then collision.
Clinton Jonasson Australia (Verified User) Posts 447 Dogs 17 / Races 38 18 Jun 2012 10:27
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Collision for me , Sean looks good on paper
Have a look at fully advanced breeding , similarities here
Cheers clint
Sean O'Donnell Australia (Verified User) Posts 4262 Dogs 64 / Races 54 18 Jun 2012 10:30
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my example was purely speculative as eventually id put an outcrosses to all my bitches!
but as for my reasoning of why kinloch brae may suit bombastic shiraz is because of fortress proving with bombastic shiraz by way of velocette and the molotov aspect potentially working well with big daddy cool by way of radley bale!
with outcrossing to bring back in lines such has been done in the past and proven to work with certain lines being added e.g. brett lee / spiral nakita or go wildy teddy x larkhill jo-staplers jo leads me to question what gentic/racing traits have afforded success!
and if full outcrosses are put directly to those austrailan lines that have proven to work with the out cross added years prior could it be a fact that it proves to not only fortify a breed but produce race dogs instantly example glenn gallon!
it may have been a bad example to put WOW on as an example because i could come up with about 10 examples of greyhounds that would suit her and had done so on another thread!
yet im really curious to know more in depth detail about kinloch brae whom i know bugger all about?
Richard Ocic Australia (Verified User) Posts 115 Dogs 0 / Races 0 18 Jun 2012 10:37
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Sean why do you bother looking for other outcrosses mate when the same outcross has produced this litter???? I would be hard pressed to go anywhere else with the evidence what the line has produced when crossed to PF. Do you not like Premier Fantasy??? This litter is well on the way to 500K
what are peoples thoughts on this sire i know darren macdonald has some frozen in country for bitches on season i wonder if anyone knows of his racing style, reports on offspring!
Sean O'Donnell Australia (Verified User) Posts 4262 Dogs 64 / Races 54 18 Jun 2012 10:54
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richard ocic wrote:
Sean why do you bother looking for other outcrosses mate when the same outcross has produced this litter???? Do you not like Premier Fantasy??? This litter is well on the way to 500K
what are peoples thoughts on this sire i know darren macdonald has some frozen in country for bitches on season i wonder if anyone knows of his racing style, reports on offspring!
hello richard no its not that i dont like premier fantasy but id do like to question all import sires and their potential to input at every level and as i did a search on kinloch brae in forum i couldnt find anything and hence my question?
as for premier fantasy he has seemed to produce best to brett lee bitches and yes will he seems to work with big daddy cool via que sera sera - yowyeh being the most noted from her litters, essentially the addition of bombastic changes things and while he has produced well i also know of some very ordinary ones as well so maybe hit and miss kind of sire (he seems to have thrown high strung pups from what i have seen and heard) you could say im not convinced it would work, yet not convinced it wouldnt!
Grant Thomas Australia (Verified User) Posts 11447 Dogs 64 / Races 20 18 Jun 2012 11:01
Richard Ocic Australia (Verified User) Posts 115 Dogs 0 / Races 0 18 Jun 2012 11:03
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Sean, There is no guarantee when breeding any litter and i believe you risk increases when you decide to outcross but with our lines we have no choice but to cross @ some stage.
Richard
Sean O'Donnell Australia (Verified User) Posts 4262 Dogs 64 / Races 54 18 Jun 2012 11:07
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very true their is never a garuntee when breeding in general with any sire!
im allways curious to pick apart everything and cheers grant for showing an example of what i was meaning!
hope all is well richard!
Grant Thomas Australia (Verified User) Posts 11447 Dogs 64 / Races 20 18 Jun 2012 11:08
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richard ocic wrote:
Sean, There is no guarantee when breeding any litter and i believe you risk increases when you decide to outcross but with our lines we have no choice but to cross @ some stage.
Richard
Proofs in 'the pudding'...some of the best dogs and bitches in the last half dozen yrs...belong to the biggest user of overseas blood...The Wheelers...whether you believe in outcross or not...they have the runs on the board to prove it can be very successful...what if 'the experiment' failed...???
Richard Ocic Australia (Verified User) Posts 115 Dogs 0 / Races 0 18 Jun 2012 11:12
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Grant Paul Wheeler has been outcrossing for years mate and its generations and generations of breeding the first initial cross can be a bit of a risk they go real good when you bring the blood back into australia lines after been crossed in terms of race stock have a good look at wheelers top bitches and when they were outcrossed and to which sires have produced the goods when returned to likes of GWT just to mention 1. When you outcross you must have a 10 year plan not expect group winners in 2 years if you do thats a big bonus.
Half of australian bitches can't use GWT as there too inbred
one of probably hundreds of examples would be Vista Bale went to outcross Ashom bale (braddy) produced average dogs in comparison when in turn 1 of the bitches bended flex went to GWT. Decade or more of planning. CLICK HERE
Grant Thomas Australia (Verified User) Posts 11447 Dogs 64 / Races 20 18 Jun 2012 11:46
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richard ocic wrote:
Grant Paul Wheeler has been outcrossing for years mate and its generations and generations of breeding the first initial cross can be a bit of a risk they go real good when you bring the blood back into australia lines after been crossed in terms of race stock have a good look at wheelers top bitches and when they were outcrossed and to which sires have produced the goods when returned to likes of GWT just to mention 1. When you outcross you must have a 10 year plan not expect group winners in 2 years if you do thats a big bonus.
Half of australian bitches can't use GWT as there too inbred
one of probably hundreds of examples would be Vista Bale went to outcross Ashom bale (braddy) produced average dogs in comparison when in turn 1 of the bitches bended flex went to GWT. Decade or more of planning. CLICK HERE
Yes...Richard...as I posted the last 6 yrs..(when they obviously have returned to 'our' sires) = results...
Obviously my 1st..." Proofs in 'the pudding'...and last..." what if 'the experiment' failed...???...hold sway...
How do you work out that Ashom Bale was an 'OUTCROSS' sire...???
Richard Ocic Australia (Verified User) Posts 115 Dogs 0 / Races 0 19 Jun 2012 11:28
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How do you work out that Ashom Bale was an 'OUTCROSS' sire...???
the dam was outcrossed to BRADDY mate has imported us blood definitely not 100 percent aussie breeding.
Grant Thomas Australia (Verified User) Posts 11447 Dogs 64 / Races 20 19 Jun 2012 11:34
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Most of us regard a OUTCROSS sire as one with no relation...Ashom Bale would be considered a SEMI outcross sire...
BRADDY was certainly a OUTCROSS to Monalee Bale...
Richard Ocic Australia (Verified User) Posts 115 Dogs 0 / Races 0 19 Jun 2012 11:40
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All Iam trying to say is that if your going to outcross your dam line don't expect the best racers until 2nd and 3rd generations if you get a handy litter on the initial cross thats a bonus. Anyway back to Kinloch brae which i know nothing about lol
Richard
Grant Thomas Australia (Verified User) Posts 11447 Dogs 64 / Races 20 19 Jun 2012 12:13
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He's the sire of the last Irish Derby winner...keep up Rich...
Do you have questions about breeding theories? 
