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Ross Farmer Australia (Verified User) Posts 208 Dogs 0 / Races 1 18 Feb 2018 10:14
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From my exposure,
Good tracks (though haven't seen all) Growing - only state with increase in tracks Happy and friendly attitude of participants (even to Victorians) Good rapport between participants and GRSA
Perhaps I am only seeing the superficial, but it does seem that SA is getting a lot right.
Will be interesting to see how Murray Bridge goes.
Raymond Peter Fewings Australia (Verified User) Posts 248 Dogs 0 / Races 0 18 Feb 2018 21:35
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Called in to Murray Bridge Saturday. Shaping up very well.
Sandro Bechini Australia (Verified User) Posts 19488 Dogs 15268 / Races 1856 18 Feb 2018 21:38
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Hi Ray
From what I have seen on the GRSA newsletters it looks like its going to be a terrific set up with the horseshoe track and the 400m straight track parallel to the home straight
Hopefully, it will eliminate all those 400m bend starts you guys have at your tracks
Charles W Mizzi Australia (Verified User) Posts 684 Dogs 1 / Races 1 19 Feb 2018 00:42
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Ross Farmer wrote:
From my exposure,
Good tracks (though haven't seen all) Growing - only state with increase in tracks Happy and friendly attitude of participants (even to Victorians) Good rapport between participants and GRSA
Perhaps I am only seeing the superficial, but it does seem that SA is getting a lot right.
Will be interesting to see how Murray Bridge goes.
If Matt Corby can't get it right, no one can. A CEO with a huge background in greyhound racing, had been the CEO of Sandown for many years. The smaller scale would make it easier but you still have to have the knowledge to begin with and IMO a rapport with the participants to eliminate the us and them which has been around for years and years, for good reason especially here in Victoria.
Jamie Quinlivian Australia (Verified User) Posts 8727 Dogs 10 / Races 0 19 Feb 2018 01:31
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When it all hit the fan a couple of years ago, the CEO and the Chairman of the Board held meetings with trainers, in the kennel house, before Thursday nights meeting, to update and explain where things were at politically. Not sure how many other states met the trainers face to face.
GRSA staff, from the CEO to the catching pen attendant, have always been approachable and responsive, even if you are having a whinge.
I think they need a prizemoney boost on Thursdays to attract more interstate owners who are on 50/50 deals. Example, Monday & Tuesday prizemoney is approx 75% of Vic provincial but Thursday is only 50% of Vic metro. But building a new track in this climate shows courage and confidence in a future. Im surprised more people havent moved there to set up.
Charles W Mizzi Australia (Verified User) Posts 684 Dogs 1 / Races 1 19 Feb 2018 02:28
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Jamie Quinlivian wrote:
When it all hit the fan a couple of years ago, the CEO and the Chairman of the Board held meetings with trainers, in the kennel house, before Thursday nights meeting, to update and explain where things were at politically. Not sure how many other states met the trainers face to face.
GRSA staff, from the CEO to the catching pen attendant, have always been approachable and responsive, even if you are having a whinge.
I think they need a prizemoney boost on Thursdays to attract more interstate owners who are on 50/50 deals. Example, Monday & Tuesday prizemoney is approx 75% of Vic provincial but Thursday is only 50% of Vic metro. But building a new track in this climate shows courage and confidence in a future. Im surprised more people havent moved there to set up.
Thanks Jamie,
Shame that did not happen in Victoria.
They were to busy running around saving their own arses. What a different world we would be living in, in Victoria if GRSA's example was known and followed and maybe it was and it was ignored.
Because politically is where the problem lies and instead of talking to trainers and supporting them they lumped people who had a case to answer and ones that did not together and crucified them to appease the Greens and the anti's making a spectacle of the whole shemozzle.
Bring on November, the Victorian Government's day of reckoning!
A vote for Labor is a vote for the Greens and we know what they stand for.
Mark Staines Australia (Verified User) Posts 4497 Dogs 70 / Races 14 19 Feb 2018 03:55
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SA resident B.Scott is employed in NSW, so SA is definitely getting it right !
Bruce Teague Australia (Verified User) Posts 2092 Dogs 0 / Races 0 19 Feb 2018 04:16
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Ross,
All of us, me included, are talking about and from a limited number of areas. However, its worth noting a few things.
SA has a board which represents the clubs, individually and as a whole. Corby is neither a public servant or a blow-in. SA staff members are contactable by their email addresses thats unique. The monthly Kennel Capers offers plenty of frank info about what is happening or envisaged. It does not contain waffle or boring platitudes about how good we are. Some states offer nothing at all. SA is partly dependent on PAW output, which is threatened, but Victoria is more vulnerable. SA (and Tasmania) opted to go with Tatts for reasons I cannot fathom. Now the Tabcorp merger is moving into place these states could expect to see improvement in pools and therefore in turnover, commissions and prize money. SA has been quite proactive in organising publicity via radio and GAP. Murray Bridge 550m has a bend start but may not be heavily used. TBA. * In my view, both major tracks warrant modest corrections to their design/layouts but they are manageable in the meantime.
Where there is a will there is always hope. Dog numbers would be the immediate risk.
Robyn Mackellar Australia (Verified User) Posts 870 Dogs 41 / Races 138 19 Feb 2018 05:56
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There are very few PAW dogs now in SA. Breeding is on the rise. Have very good stewards and kennel staff. Prizemoney is below par!!...management needs to keep listening to participants.
Jamie Quinlivian Australia (Verified User) Posts 8727 Dogs 10 / Races 0 19 Feb 2018 06:02
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SA is not reliant on Wheeler dogs Bruce. Not partially, not at all. It may have been the case a few years back, but now its just a myth. Like saying 'send your dog to SA and win plenty of races'. A myth. Most Bale dogs in SA are not owned by Wheeler.
Oh hello Robyn, you beat me by a nose. Again
Michael Barry Australia (Verified User) Posts 7402 Dogs 26 / Races 9 19 Feb 2018 07:16
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I think bruce gets a lot of his information on a lot of subjects From the archives lol
Raymond Peter Fewings Australia (Verified User) Posts 248 Dogs 0 / Races 0 19 Feb 2018 08:56
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Once Murray Bridge is completed prizemoney is SA's major objective.
Bruce Teague Australia (Verified User) Posts 2092 Dogs 0 / Races 0 19 Feb 2018 22:08
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Jamie,
Fair enough - the proportions have fallen dramatically in recent times. Still, previously it was not uncommon to see 3 or 4 in a single race so he did provide some of the backbone.
But note that Vic is short of dogs so there would be less incentive or need at the moment to send them over. Plus his total numbers are starting to ease.
Whatever, a major decline in PAW output - which he has mandated - is a serious risk to Oz racing, irrespective of how it comes out in the wash.
Sandro Bechini Australia (Verified User) Posts 19488 Dogs 15268 / Races 1856 19 Feb 2018 22:53
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Bruce
He runs a business, he is just adjusting to the status quo
Like all larger breeders, his production has to decrease because, with the restriction on exports, there are less options to relocate greyhounds that are at the end of their career and even fewer options to rehome them locally
With lack of greyhounds in all states, especially performing 500m+ greyhounds in the major racing centres, it is far more economical for him to leave them where they are
Grading in all States needs to be adjusted to SA's model with the progression of maidens to juveniles to Grade 6's etc so that a greyhounds racing life can be staggered whilst it is learning its craft
It is not uncommon for SA greyhounds to have 100 starts. They must be doing something right.
An increase in this area would ease the pressure on rehoming and thus reduce the need to breed unnecessarily
These two areas alone in the racing greyhound's life cycle needs a major overhaul if you want to see breeding numbers increase by any meaningful number
Robyn Mackellar Australia (Verified User) Posts 870 Dogs 41 / Races 138 19 Feb 2018 23:05
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Agree with you Sandro, I believe we have the best grading, even better for locally bred stock.
Ray Brown Australia (Team Member) Posts 6225 Dogs 8 / Races 5 19 Feb 2018 23:20
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All you need in future is the POWER supply to be maintained, that may be a problem the way things are going.
Bruce Teague Australia (Verified User) Posts 2092 Dogs 0 / Races 0 20 Feb 2018 03:42
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Sandro,
"He runs a business, he is just adjusting to the status quo"
His stated reason was the burden of excessive regulation.
To see breeding numbers improve you first need to conduct a serious, professional investigation into the reasons for the long term downturn. No doubt that would include your points. Meantime, everyone is guessing or ignoring the subject.
It's funny that once upon a time club graders were well able to sort out Grade 5s into suitable mixes according to their experience and age. Similarly Grades 1 to 4. A few mishaps and that job went to town and later into the computer. Once there, it was straightforward to add more and more and more "grades" and associated conditions - at a cost, of course. There are now 125 different "grades" in total.
By the way, Juveniles and Grade 6 were in place in Tassie long before SA adopted them.
The more complex the system the more people you need at head office, the more powerful are the bureaucrats and the less any imagination is needed at clubs.
We have digressed. I agreed SA is doing nicely. I particularly like the painted tram displaying the GAP message.
Sandro Bechini Australia (Verified User) Posts 19488 Dogs 15268 / Races 1856 20 Feb 2018 06:13
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Bruce Teague wrote:
Sandro,
"He runs a business, he is just adjusting to the status quo"
His stated reason was the burden of excessive regulation.
All business adjust to outside influences in the economy or by Government Regulation that affects them
His is no different
Bruce Teague wrote:
To see breeding numbers improve you first need to conduct a serious, professional investigation into the reasons for the long term downturn. No doubt that would include your points. Meantime, everyone is guessing or ignoring the subject.
Risk & Return govern all business like activities including breeding of greyhounds
Is there a strong market for pups? Since 4 corners and subsequent government intervention it is perceived there isn't
Are prizemoney levels stagnating or increasing and outstripping costs?
This is a long term problem as the industry has been shrinking slowly over the last two decades with low uptake from the younger demographic
The more short term impact on breeding numbers is the Government/Regulatory intervention by way of restricting exports, imposing limits on females breeding, higher administrative costs, higher compliance costs, life style tracking of greyhounds etc etc which have all placed additional burdens upon breeders/owners
Bruce Teague wrote:
It's funny that once upon a time club graders were well able to sort out Grade 5s into suitable mixes according to their experience and age. Similarly Grades 1 to 4. A few mishaps and that job went to town and later into the computer. Once there, it was straightforward to add more and more and more "grades" and associated conditions - at a cost, of course. There are now 125 different "grades" in total.
Far too capital intensive to have a grader to grade every dog
However, there should be a grader that oversees the process especially where people usually forget to put the 2nd preference in and up missing out on a run
e.g. club advertises for 500m maiden heats
They get 12 nominations for the heats, 6 of the nominations put an open maiden as a 2nd preference, the other 6 have forgotten to put a 2nd preference for the open maiden (the usual reason is that in the past the grader would include them in an open maiden, if there were not enough dogs for 2 heats)
The computer grades a 6 dog open maiden, the other 6 are not given the opportunity to get a run in that maiden due to their nomination not being filled out with a 2nd preference
This happens a lot in the NSW system, not sure about the other states
Bruce Teague wrote:
By the way, Juveniles and Grade 6 were in place in Tassie long before SA adopted them.
Yes I know but their Juveniles are now called Grade 6 and are restricted to dogs < 24 months of age
They have no maiden races, The Grade 6 races are basically mixed races
They don't have this path that SA have: Maiden --> Juvenile --> Grade 6
Bruce Teague wrote:
The more complex the system the more people you need at head office, the more powerful are the bureaucrats and the less any imagination is needed at clubs.
No you don't, you just need a fair grading system, a powerful computer, a well written program, a person who acts a chief grader to iron out anomalies and not just accept what the computer spits out, a person that will ring participants to ensure that what they nominated via the online system is what they wanted and to educate them with it, and an online interface at the client level that is easily understood
You also still need club secretaries who are active in their communities to gain sponsorship and to liaise with the grader on the fields being formulated and the nomination flwo
Bruce Teague wrote:
We have digressed. I agreed SA is doing nicely. I particularly like the painted tram displaying the GAP message.
Agree
Damien Bates Australia (Verified User) Posts 127 Dogs 0 / Races 8 20 Feb 2018 20:05
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Sandro Bechini wrote:
Bruce
He runs a business, he is just adjusting to the status quo
Like all larger breeders, his production has to decrease because, with the restriction on exports, there are less options to relocate greyhounds that are at the end of their career and even fewer options to rehome them locally
With lack of greyhounds in all states, especially performing 500m+ greyhounds in the major racing centres, it is far more economical for him to leave them where they are
Grading in all States needs to be adjusted to SA's model with the progression of maidens to juveniles to Grade 6's etc so that a greyhounds racing life can be staggered whilst it is learning its craft
It is not uncommon for SA greyhounds to have 100 starts. They must be doing something right.
An increase in this area would ease the pressure on rehoming and thus reduce the need to breed unnecessarily
These two areas alone in the racing greyhound's life cycle needs a major overhaul if you want to see breeding numbers increase by any meaningful number
You make Some valid points there Sandro in terms of decrease in breeding. Also the two trainers that have trained Bale dogs for years, one is no longer in the industry and the other has very few of his dogs. Im sure the finish on lure being removed from Angle Park also has some effect on the number of dogs that are now sent to SA
Kev Galloway Australia (Verified User) Posts 2447 Dogs 5 / Races 0 20 Feb 2018 20:29
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South Australia won't get it right until they re instate the FOL full time,greyhound welfare still plays second fiddle to the GAP.