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All my own fault


Jamie Quinlivian
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 8727
Dogs 10 / Races 0

10 Aug 2018 22:48


 (18)
 (0)


Recently, a dog trained by me returned a positive swab to caffeine.
My reaction was to blame everyone from Satan to the Wiggles, everyone but myself.
But mostly I blamed the owner of the dog who was handling him on raceday. To the extent of having his dogs removed from my kennel instantly.

Last night I discovered the source of the positive and I need to make it public so that anyone else using this product can be informed. And also to make a public apology to the owner.

The product is Turmerix. I have been using this product for almost 12 months. Before that I was using plain turmeric.
Looking at the ingredients yesterday, I found green tea powder listed. I hadn't seen this before, obviously didn't look hard enough. Nowhere on the bottle does it say 'contains caffeine' and it actually says 'pet friendly' in big letters just underneath the ingredients. Even the salesman told me that several horse trainers use it.
As I said, I have used this product for about a year and had many swabs in that time come back negative. The caffeine must be in very trace amounts and I must have put an extra shake in the night before the race.

I am not trying to win peoples approval here or lessen the penalty, what will be will be and I accept whatever is coming.
I just want to make it public that the owner of the dog, John is not to blame. And anyone using turmerix should throw it in the bin.

Fire away.





Malcolm Smart
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 12802
Dogs 19 / Races 34

10 Aug 2018 23:08


 (8)
 (1)


F*(% anybody else, its john you have to make it up to..good start public apology.


Ronald George Hunter
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4318
Dogs 0 / Races 0

11 Aug 2018 01:21


 (3)
 (0)


Would'nt have expected anything else but a public apology from
you Jamie. You have always called it as it is, and this is no different. To be man enough to admit when your wrong takes some
doing. Acceptance though takes a little longer. Good on you mate.


Mark Donohue
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 3236
Dogs 6 / Races 0

11 Aug 2018 02:33


 (0)
 (0)


EXTERNAL LINK
Borrowed from Malcolms post on another thread.


Charles W Mizzi
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 684
Dogs 1 / Races 1

11 Aug 2018 03:08


 (2)
 (2)


Jamie Quinlivian wrote:

Recently, a dog trained by me returned a positive swab to caffeine.
My reaction was to blame everyone from Satan to the Wiggles, everyone but myself.
But mostly I blamed the owner of the dog who was handling him on raceday. To the extent of having his dogs removed from my kennel instantly.

Last night I discovered the source of the positive and I need to make it public so that anyone else using this product can be informed. And also to make a public apology to the owner.

The product is Turmerix. I have been using this product for almost 12 months. Before that I was using plain turmeric.
Looking at the ingredients yesterday, I found green tea powder listed. I hadn't seen this before, obviously didn't look hard enough. Nowhere on the bottle does it say 'contains caffeine' and it actually says 'pet friendly' in big letters just underneath the ingredients. Even the salesman told me that several horse trainers use it.
As I said, I have used this product for about a year and had many swabs in that time come back negative. The caffeine must be in very trace amounts and I must have put an extra shake in the night before the race.

I am not trying to win peoples approval here or lessen the penalty, what will be will be and I accept whatever is coming.
I just want to make it public that the owner of the dog, John is not to blame. And anyone using turmerix should throw it in the bin.

Fire away.


Good on you Jamie, a great example of integrity.

Now I wish more people would jump up and down about animal welfare because the welfare of the racing greyhound has come down in recent times, B group vitamins, seaweed meal, anything that has a smigen of tea or chocolate that you may not know about, it has become a joke. The authorities do not divulge how much is present and this has been brought up in a couple of cases at VCAT. Expert opinions not based in science are then used to justify.

This is another way of degrading the industry and give the anti's the drug cheat tag.

In Victoria, come November people have the opportunity to change what has been happening since the Mouldy Labor Party got in (Mould is Green right)


Bruce Teague
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 2092
Dogs 0 / Races 0

11 Aug 2018 05:24


 (5)
 (0)


Nice Jamie but are we missing the bigger point?

10 years ago (possibly) the labs may not have picked this up anyway. Their gear is better now, they know what they are looking for, there are more of them, and we are living in a different world.

Sweet It Is had the same problem in NZ when the NZ Chief Steward reported that tea was an ingredient in the kibble given to the bitch.

Similarly, everyday substances like cobalt and arsenic pop up in swabs all over the place simply because they are present everywhere.

Theoretically, the so-called minimum thresholds should cater for the extremely tiny amounts involved in most cases. Perhaps so, perhaps not, but those thresholds were (a) pretty arbitrary, (b) established via dubious tests or copied from the horses, and (c) have a still unknown effect on the racing animal (we already have one scientific claim that cobalt testing and amount is irrelevant or wrongly organised).

The upshot is the implementation of a zero tolerance policy. In turn that is being justified mostly on the ground or either welfare considerations or public image - both in the waffly area.

But clearly the subject has expanded beyond the realms of practicality (as I have instanced in the danger of walking your dog past a hot bread shop using poppy seeds).

There may be a case either way but, irrespective of that, the current policy lacks insufficient science to justify destroying a dog's or a trainer's career. It is simply not believable enough. It should be challenged.




Michael Geraghty
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4138
Dogs 14 / Races 15

11 Aug 2018 10:02


 (1)
 (0)


Well, that's not good, Quinny.
I would imagine that the level would have been minute which brings me to the argument that in this day and age they can quantitatively test for all substances and common sense should prevail on accidental positives.
Anyone can make a slip up like that and just goes to show you now have to Lab test the air that they breathe.
The testing now can pick up signatures of substances (not even the substance itself) and deliver a positive...it's unrealistic in 2018.

"But mostly I blamed the owner of the dog who was handling him on raceday. To the extent of having his dogs removed from my kennel instantly."
Well, all I can say to that is...OUCH!!!
Probably not the smartest thing to do...

Hopefully you can get over the hump.

posts 7