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Calum Andersen Australia (Verified User) Posts 913 Dogs 5 / Races 1 25 Jun 2015 20:46
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Have you spoken to westy? I asked him one day why the price rise on bekim bale cause imo he isnt worth it and he said the price rise was to try and cut the numbers down that want to use him if he was at $1000 then everyone would be ringjng non stop and theres only so much to go around if hes at $2000 then a percentage of the breeders think no ill wait when I can get such and such dog for only $1000. If fernando bale went to stud at $1650 sean then westy would need 5 phone lines and none would ever stop ringing and theres only so many serves to go around, he has to say no to too many people!
Michael Bowerman Australia (Verified User) Posts 4615 Dogs 11 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 21:12
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when fernando bale goes to stud i say his price would be between 4 or 5 thousand dollars,
Brett Margerison Australia (Verified User) Posts 690 Dogs 16 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 21:14
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michael bowerman wrote:
when fernando bale goes to stud i say his price would be between 4 or 5 thousand dollars,
It's $3300 atm I believe...
Gavin Kelly Australia (Verified User) Posts 397 Dogs 0 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 21:15
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Westy can also update their website to show a figure of straws available for each quarter not that hard to do .
I 100% agree with Sean
It's not about what the dog can offer and what he deserves to be priced at, its about supporting the Industry and all its members who are struggling
As breeding is down and the number of pups born are down this will only show PAW Having half the fields in 2 year times and I would say the punters would bet less money . Less betting revenue means less prize money to be paid out. It's simple maths really . I know quite a few punters that will not bet if there is 3 or more from one kennel in a race .
When the big breeders are getting less prize money in a few years they will wish they listen and helped the common person out in the industry There's plenty of time to make money but the money is needing to be shared to all.
JMO
Tom Richards Australia (Verified User) Posts 1003 Dogs 0 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 21:44
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100 quality bitches at $3k, has many advantages over 300 "ordinary" bitches at $1k.
Same money , but what is best long term? Quality bitches goes a long way to the career of a sire.
Gavin Kelly Australia (Verified User) Posts 397 Dogs 0 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 21:55
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Start a $2,000
Breeders will not breed with ordinary bitches as they will not be able to sell pups
Why is everyone justify the price
We are not saying it's over priced we just said
How about helping the industry out be lowering the price As what I said above will happen if the common person is priced out
Last I will say on this
Kayla-Jane Coleman Australia (Verified User) Posts 29 Dogs 7 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 22:24
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I think what you are forgetting is that Fernando isn't actually at stud per say. Had he been fully retired to stud he probably would of started at 2,200 or 2,750 (or could still of been 3,300) Its called supply and demand. If he was yours what would u have him at knowing there isn't many straws. Me personally I think people are lucky he is letting some go. I would keep them for myself and my broods for now while he isn't actually at stud and only a handful of straws. And knowing his still racing so not drawing him much. Its like concert tickets that sell out in 2minutes. They are highly sort after so u can do whatever you want. And since when is it Paul's job to save the industry. Its his dog he can do what he wants. No one else is dropping prices. The main thing is the dog isnt a full stud dog yet. So he is what he is. And he has every right to be I think
Sean O'Donnell Australia (Verified User) Posts 4262 Dogs 64 / Races 54 25 Jun 2015 22:35
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So he has sold out at $3300 and somehow if he goes into full stud duties he will be placed at $2200 or $2750? I highly doubt it! Yes Paul wheeler doesn't have to do anything for the industry as the industry has done nothing for him? Except provide an avenue and platform to make many millions I mean why would you remember where you came from or what it was like to do it tough or that it's the quintessential battlers sport! Cash is king right! Take what you can and as much as you can, give nothing back!
Sorry Kayla I don't agree!
Toby Weekes Australia (Verified User) Posts 225 Dogs 69 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 22:46
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I fully agree with kayla on this, I have used Fernando over rinoa bale and $3300 is the cheapest part of rearing a litter for me ,even $2200 or $2750 is a fair price as any breeder will recoup in pup sales easy plus this dog is a freak of a dog
Kayla-Jane Coleman Australia (Verified User) Posts 29 Dogs 7 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 23:07
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No Sean the fact that he is sold out at 3300 says he won't drop when he goes on full stud duties. I said if was fully retired and he went straight to full stud duties he prob would of been cheaper. Well if people sent happy with it hopefully its made there phones abit quieter but I doubt it. Just because Paul has succeeded in the industry doesn't mean he has to do us any favours. The industry has helped a lot of people out. I don't see Brett Lee, Collision or where's Pedro dropping there prices. The industry helped them to. The things they share in common is limited straws and high demand. At the end of the day it doesn't matter he can do what he wants. If people want them they pay. And if they dont they use someone else. Paul owes us nothing. People are quick to bag him. Yet they want him to do them favours
Matt Griffiths Australia (Verified User) Posts 1955 Dogs 56 / Races 2 25 Jun 2015 23:15
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People don't breed unless they see something in their broodie. Wouldn't have mattered if he was $330, $3300 or $13300 if people want to use Fernando Bale they will pay the price. considering how dominant he has been recently though $3300 is about right.
I personally would never pay $3300 for him when you can get an American outcross from a dog I prefer like hooksy or glen gallon for a third of the price.
Sean O'Donnell Australia (Verified User) Posts 4262 Dogs 64 / Races 54 25 Jun 2015 23:21
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Where's pedro I don't know what he started at but I believe it wasn't $3300 until he was proven as he was playing second fiddle to hallucinate for a spell!
Brett lee wel he was a level above but I recall someone saying he started at $2750.
And collision he was $2200 long after he had sired multiple group winners. But you are talking a time when the industry was thriving and also the need for compete effectively stud prices were a must based in ability of sites that were producing.
Paul wheeler owes no one anything and going by the pricing of his sites he is happy to take all he can get! Sorry as I said not a display of gratitude for good fortune in my eyes and hardly a positive for the industry!
Kayla-Jane Coleman Australia (Verified User) Posts 29 Dogs 7 / Races 0 25 Jun 2015 23:59
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I wasn't talking prices they started at I'm talking now. Noone else is dropping prices because of the industry's delemias. I'll tell u now if I had a straw and someone couldnt get one I'd be charging more than 3.300 that's for sure cause u don't know when u will get another. Like I said did story if he was fully at stud doing his full book every quarter. And even if he was 3,300 then it don't matter. U use him or u dont. Simple. Everyone has there own opinion. But i still don't think we should be saying what paul should and shouldnt do and what he should be doing for us. Its business simple. I know for a fact he has missed out on using him on his own bitches because he has none left. So he has done us a favour by selling some. He has missed out himself. Each to there own. He is what he is. No use bagging people about there choices. THATS WHATS WRONG WITH THIS INDUSTRY
Sean O'Donnell Australia (Verified User) Posts 4262 Dogs 64 / Races 54 26 Jun 2015 00:17
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It's called an opinion and what's wrong with the industry is far beyond what you, I or others value a sires fee, if fernando bale dropped dead tommorow yes more people other than paul would miss out, an additional advantage is fernando bale finishes racing in 6-12 months he has offspring on the ground earlier (double edged sword that one)
Hardly a price that reflects a fair fee for a freshman who still has to prove himself once he has ceased racing, sorry if I feel for someone that's had such good fortune they could be more fair dinkum about the price of stud fees vs sucking the marrow dollars wise out of all and sundry.
Fair enough if a sires has produced multiple group winners, but we are talking fresh and sires who are exceeding all before them! I don't think it's in the best interest for the industry but what would I know?
Anyway back to fernando bale the race dog!
John McAlister Australia (Verified User) Posts 6567 Dogs 1 / Races 0 26 Jun 2015 01:31
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toby weekes wrote:
I fully agree with kayla on this, I have used Fernando over rinoa bale and $3300 is the cheapest part of rearing a litter for me ,even $2200 or $2750 is a fair price as any breeder will recoup in pup sales easy plus this dog is a freak of a dog
you hope
Kevin Wright Australia (Verified User) Posts 5708 Dogs 1 / Races 1 26 Jun 2015 05:41
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Are you crazy $3500 is cheap considering he is still racing and is clearly ONE OF australia's greatest chaser I would pay $5000 if I wanted too and to say someone is greedy because they choose to set a price above what some consider to be market value is absurd and ridiculous....
Opinion is a belief stronger than impression and less strong than positive knowledge ...
Tom Richards Australia (Verified User) Posts 1003 Dogs 0 / Races 0 26 Jun 2015 08:28
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stud fee is cheapest part of getting a pup to the track. Divide the stud fee by the number of pups and it is $400-500 per pup (6-8 pups)
$1500 stud is $200 per pup. Whats $200-300 in the total cost of getting a pup to the track?
Ray Morcomb Australia (Verified User) Posts 1331 Dogs 6 / Races 0 26 Jun 2015 08:32
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I agree. This dog is special and is without doubt the best since Brett Lee but I believe even better. So why should he be at the service fee of all the other dogs?
You want the best you pay for the best
kevin wright wrote:
Are you crazy $3500 is cheap considering he is still racing and is clearly ONE OF australia's greatest chaser I would pay $5000 if I wanted too and to say someone is greedy because they choose to set a price above what some consider to be market value is absurd and ridiculous....
Opinion is a belief stronger than impression and less strong than positive knowledge ...
John McAlister Australia (Verified User) Posts 6567 Dogs 1 / Races 0 26 Jun 2015 08:46
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Ray he may be the best on the track the best in the barn is a long way off but each to their own I guess I think it's a case of how one feels about his dollars whether he wants to give them away or not me well I am more inclined to back the bitch and my rearing education etc I think the stud dog is only a small cog in the very big wheel I have a bitch here now that would suit him but the Wheeler Stud dog syndrome is the stopper how many top class or good sires has been bred by the kennel from the breed
Michael Barry Australia (Verified User) Posts 7402 Dogs 26 / Races 9 26 Jun 2015 09:39
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i find it almost unbelievable how on this thread some people want to kiss paul wheelers ass ,, yet on other threads the same people want to tear him to pieces lollllllllllllllllll
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